Category: Podcast Episodes

Carrie McCormick started her real estate career working with developers before transitioning into her own production where she is routinely in the top 1% of all real estate brokers. One of Carrie’s specialties is providing her clients off-market properties (non-MLS listings). She works almost exclusively by referral and answers every single phone call, day or night. We’re glad her clients didn’t try to call during our podcast! 🙂

Carrie can be reached at carrie@atproperties.com or by phone at 312.961.4612

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:15
Hello, and welcome to another episode of Keeping it real the real estate podcast made by real estate brokers for real estate brokers. My name is DJ Parris. I’m your host, and for your things before we get started with today’s show, we wanted to roll out a new feature for upcoming interviews, we’re going to be asking your questions to some of the brokers that we are interviewing. So if you have questions for brokers, and again, we usually talk to top producers. So we have a lot of brokers out there who have questions that they would like a top producer to answer, you can actually submit those questions directly to us either by through our Facebook page, which you can find us by going to facebook.com forward slash keeping it real pod or just search for keeping it real pod and Facebook. Or you could go to our website, which is keeping it real pod.com or email us directly at Jen je n at keeping it real pod.com. Today on the show, we have Kerry McCormick, who we just finished speaking with and had a great conversation. She is a top 1% broker and has a tremendous amount of experience. She started on the development side and then moved into her own personal production. And she works almost exclusively by referrals has a lot of funny stories to tell along the way. And also she works a lot of off market properties, non MLS properties, which I think a lot of brokers are always interested in learning how do I get involved. So this is a really great interview and she did a wonderful job. We’re excited to bring this to you now so enjoy

today on the show, we have Carrie McCormick from App properties. Carrie is a leader in the luxury and development market. She has more than 18 years of real estate sales experience along with an unsurpassed reputation of quality, results oriented service and support. She’s made an indelible mark on Chicagoans real estate market and her track record speaks for itself a Chicago Association of Realtors has right Carrie among its top 1% of Realtors year over year. Last year she also earned the struggle Association of Realtors Gold Award and she participates in addition to that participates as a member in the Chicago Builders Association. And besides her many accolades in the industry, Karis is continually rewarded with referrals and repeat business from loyal clients who have benefited from her experience her vast knowledge as a native Chicago and combined with her patient, yet persistent approach to getting clients is getting clients rather what they want makes her an invaluable partner in the real estate process. So welcome. We’re so grateful Carrie, that you’re on the show.

Carrie McCormick 2:57
Hi, I’m glad to be here.

D.J. Paris 3:00
Well, thank you, I know you are incredibly busy. So this is this is very much appreciated. But let’s start at the beginning because you have this 18 year career that is still, you know, continues to grow and build. But how did you get started in the industry?

Carrie McCormick 3:15
Great question. So it goes back all the way back to 1999. And actually, I worked on the development side of the business here in Chicago. I have worked for some of the most well respected Builders here in Chicago and I started with Centrum properties, where I served as their national sales manager. And I represented some of the most iconic buildings like the Montgomery Ward building, the domain building, which was the Montgomery Ward’s catalog house. Sure. And number 10 lofts, and the list goes on. And I worked on so many projects here in the city with them. And I served as an integral member of the development team collaborating on product design, development. And you know, of course, the sales of their properties as well. And then I also worked with a developer here in Chicago called MC Z development, who has also done some incredible adaptive reuse buildings here. And I learned so much about the building process from land acquisition to site planning to architecture and design. It really was a great base for my career. And it was an invaluable experience. And I met some of the most extraordinary people the best in the business, and I still have strong relationships with them. And then from the development side, I launched into my residential sales career with App properties. And the rest is history.

D.J. Paris 4:46
So what what prompted the switch from working with developers to then doing personal production with you know, in the traditional brokerage side,

Carrie McCormick 4:54
so really it was the the market crash that had happened we all went through that In 2008, which lasted several years, so a lot of us in the business had to reinvent ourselves. And because I had such a strong database with working with a ton of people in different projects through Chicago, I had a great base of clients. And I had decided to work with another great company in Chicago, which is at properties going from, you know, the best of the best developers to one of the best residential brokerages in Chicago. And I made the switch, which I absolutely love.

D.J. Paris 5:36
Would you say your experience on the development side really helped you when you started your residential traditional Residential Brokerage?

Carrie McCormick 5:44
Absolutely. So I worked with a lot of builders, who single family home builders who were building, you know, one or two homes, and they loved that I understood the construction side of it, and was able to sell to their clients about, you know, how a home is built, and what to look for, and what’s important. So that did play an important role.

D.J. Paris 6:05
Yeah, and since you’ve been in the business for such time, you know, tough talks about how you, when you made that switch from, you know, working with developers on the development side to then working for add properties working with that properties. Let’s talk about, you know, how did you when you started, was it was it diff? I mean, you obviously had those relationships with developers. But, you know, what do you do so many brokers, you know, attempt to get in the business, whether they have those relationships or not, what do you think you did differently, that maybe other brokers didn’t, and then maybe that made the difference in your success.

Carrie McCormick 6:41
So I don’t know if it’s something that I did different. But when I started the brokerage, with my idea of working with clients, I would do the absolute best job that I could, I focused everything that I had to make sure that their experience was extraordinary. And from there, it just became referral based, you know, one person would have an excellent experience, and they would tell their friends who would tell their friends, and so on. So I would say that I’ve built my business based off of referrals. And I think that client satisfaction is the most important part of my success. And my clients joke to me that I’m always available, I’m always available 24/7, I never miss a call. I, I’m working from the break of dawn to till the sun goes down. And some of my clients joke to me and say, Do you ever sleep, because I’m sending emails at two o’clock in the morning, but that’s what it takes. And I’ve learned that early on in this business, that it just it never stops. And if you’re truly working for your client, you are working all the time. That’s

D.J. Paris 7:53
such a great point. You know, with respect to always being available, I know when I bought a condo, and this was in 2005, or six, and I was not in this business, I was just in marketing with a different company in technology. My broker was my friend. And he had a policy, which he didn’t tell me at the time. But as I think back about it, now, he really did live it, which was he never wanted me or any of his clients to have to call him first. His whole thought was, of course, when we did call him of course, he needed to be available or he wanted, you know, he he felt he needed to be available. But he said I never wanted you to have to call me to ask what was going on. In other words, like, which is a pretty good policy, I feel and I suspect you have that same policy with your clients.

Carrie McCormick 8:41
Oh, absolutely. And the best thing that I the best compliment that I’ve received recently was one of my clients had said to me that are Am I your only client and you know, I looked at them and said, You know, I’m glad you feel that way but actually I’ve got 2028 other clients right now that I’m working with and again I take that as a huge compliment because they felt like I was the only they were the only client that I had. And that just goes to show you the amount of service that that I that I offer my clients and it’s it’s important.

D.J. Paris 9:18
It’s what we have oh my gosh it’s literally the best compliment you could have received

Carrie McCormick 9:22
literally that is that is pressure now but it’s it was a great compliment

D.J. Paris 9:28
and aside from from you always being available and I know that’s the big part of it is making sure that you’re you’re their partner throughout every step of the process. Is there anything else that you do although there might not necessarily be because you know, just being there is such a big part of it. Is there anything else you do you feel that’s unique for your clients?

Carrie McCormick 9:51
There are a few things and you know, going back just to being available all the time, you know is again number one, but I am a true part partner with them in this process. And, you know, because I’ve got 18 years of experience, I know what it takes, I know what it takes to buy and sell a property. And I also have a design background. And my knowledge of staging properties and creating a visually appealing space helps my sellers increase their property value. And my clients love that. And because I’ve been in this business so long, I’ve had time to create a team of professionals that I use, for example, I’ve got my favorite photographer I can always count on I’ve got my favorite inspector, painters, electricians, I’m kind of like a one stop shop. So when they come to me with either buying a home or selling their home, I’ve got all the resources, you know, and I’ve got the best of the best.

D.J. Paris 10:50
Yeah, you never have to say, Gosh, I really don’t know.

Carrie McCormick 10:54
And that’s, that’s the one answer. I don’t like doing. I don’t know.

D.J. Paris 10:59
What What advice would you have for a newer broker, or even maybe not necessarily a newer broker, but somebody who’s struggling or really trying to build their business, you obviously have had so much incredible success. And you’ve earned Of course, every bit of it, is there any any specific habits or behaviors that you would recommend to somebody who would like to be in the position down the road that you’re in?

Carrie McCormick 11:22
Yeah, I would say just, you know, remain social, and network with your sphere that’s around you, you know, your friends, your family, when you go to different events, always have your business cards on you, you know, when I’m at an event or a gathering, of course, I don’t, you know, come out the gate and tell people, you know, what I do and try to pitch my business to them, but there’s always a good way to work it in the conversation. Because real estate is relevant in everyone’s life. And, you know, you just you’ve you find a way to, to introduce yourself and tell them what you do, and stay in contact with them. And that has been it today, it still plays a huge role in what I do.

D.J. Paris 12:07
What percentage of your business would you say, roughly would be referral based versus you going out and seeking sort of new clients?

Carrie McCormick 12:16
I would say 90% of my business is referral.

D.J. Paris 12:19
That is amazing. And again, that is a true testament to your ability to take care of your, your existing clients, because they clearly are, they clearly are think you do enough, well enough job to then of course, recommend you, you know, and I know that you also have worked and continue to work with off market properties, we’ll call them non MLS, for example. And, you know, talk about how you sort of got involved with with pocket listings or off market listing?

Carrie McCormick 12:47
Sure. So off market properties and pocket listings are a huge term here in Chicago. And I got into that, because some of my buyers were looking for a specific property, and we exhausted the MLS, and we couldn’t find what they were looking for. So we started going down the route of, you know, talking with other brokers of what properties that they had coming soon. And it paid off, because I talked with a fellow broker, and he or she would say, oh, yeah, I’ve got this listing coming, you know, it kind of matches what you’re talking about, you guys want to come in and see it. So it creates this exclusivity to my buyers that they love and this urgency to make an offer before this property goes on the market. So that had given my clients, you know, this huge advantage. And of course, I became a valuable partner in the buying process, because I was able to find them a property that wasn’t on the market. And also I belong to a few different off market networks. And it’s, you know, talking with other brokers belonging to these off market networks. And I’ve even done some knocking on doors and sending letters going the old traditional route, you know, my client wants to live on Warband Xia Street and in Bucktown, and nothing’s available, guess who’s knocking on your door?

D.J. Paris 14:10
That’s right. And you can end up possibly with a few listings that way, too.

Carrie McCormick 14:15
I mean, it’s going back old school, but sometimes you’ve got to go back to, you know, some groundwork.

D.J. Paris 14:21
I know, there’s a lot of developers or rather, I shouldn’t say developers, calm investors who, you know, will just knock on doors and neighborhoods and say, Hey, Are you the owner? Would you be interested in selling? And, you know, obviously, those properties aren’t on the market at the time. And so you you’re doing the same thing? And I’m always I thought that is you know, it’s it’s, it’s remarkable. You have to get a bit creative sometimes when the MLS is exhausted. And, and I’m not sure how much you want to talk about the off market networks. But if somebody wanted to get involved, and sort of learn more about hey, in addition to the MLS, what else is out there? Do you have any recommendations of what they might start to do to learn more,

Carrie McCormick 15:02
I would recommend them calling me and I will research all of these off market networks. They are for brokers only. So you have to connect with a broker who utilizes them and belongs to the networks, which I do.

D.J. Paris 15:17
That’s awesome. And, you know, we always ask our people, we interview their funniest real estate experience, and I know you had a one where you had to chase a seller’s dog too. What happened there? Did the dog get loose or

Carrie McCormick 15:34
it was I really wish that we had a video crew behind me because it was one of those moments that you just it’s hard to describe. But you know, I’ll try to paint the picture for you. So I have a listing in the bell school district and single family home and I show up earlier to my to my appointment to get the house ready. I opened the front door and their dog goes running out. And keep in mind I’m in heels I’m in dress in a dress, it’s 85 degrees outside the job, bolts out the front door, no collar, no leash, and I go running after the dog so I’m running down the street as fast as I can because this is my client’s family dog beloved dog. And I’m just worried that dogs gonna leave right it’s just keep running so I am running as fast as I can down the street to try to get the dog. Well the good news is the dog got tired before I did and had decided to just lay down in middle of the street. And it’s a bulldog. I don’t know how much this dog weighed but it was a big Bulldog. He lays down in the middle of the street and I’m trying my best to get this dog out of the street. I ended up having to pick him up. Oh no. And and you know I’m five foot 500 pounds myself and I’m trying to carry this dog down the street who’s probably you know, half my weight and you know, again my goal is just to get this dog back in the house and I’ve got the showing coming and I get the dog back in the house I put him in his cage. And honestly the moment I lock that cage the doorbell rings and I look in the mirror at myself and I’m just you know I’m sweaty and my hair masks and you know my dress is askew and I you know as in true real estate you know form and being a professional you straighten yourself up you put a big smile on your face and you open up that door and welcome that man and you know the showing went great but again if they were there two minutes before it would have been a different story. So you know we’ve got ton of funny stories but that was just my most recent one.

D.J. Paris 17:42
Yeah, and then you would also that is that is really funny. And good timing I guess. Yeah. And then you also told they were talking about to us off off Mike about the control for automated home system and you had sort of interesting experience with that. Can you tell that story to you man,

Carrie McCormick 18:02
I think interesting. So great word so control for and all these automated systems are wonderful technology for the home. It just it’s great and you gotta love all the technology. However you need to know how to work it. So this story is I’m working with a buyer and we’re in Bucktown single family home buyer looking young couple loves technology. So we go into the home for the showing and the sellers agent was there and she was doing a great job of giving us an overview of the home and of course wanted to talk about the automated system of the house you can you know with one touch of a button you can open up your blinds and your your lights and you know the audio system and all that good stuff. So we go into the basement of the home where the theater was and she wanted to demonstrate you know, again, touch of one button, movie comes on lights, dim shades come down all of that. Well when she did that. We realized that the homeowners had left an adult film on his screen.

D.J. Paris 19:04
Oh my goodness.

Carrie McCormick 19:06
So let’s talk about the most uncomfortable situation on a big screen. piped through the home. Of course the realtor is scrambling trying to figure out how to turn it off and what buttons you know all the buttons all the lights are going on and off and you know we decided just to leave the basement and go upstairs and you know look at the rest of the home and let her figure out the system. But again it was a whole home audio system. So the showing was a little uncomfortable walking through the home with this piping, music or dialogue going on during the showing but we made it through the home and it just it made for an interesting showing you put it at that.

D.J. Paris 19:51
Isn’t that funny? It’s it’s you would you would think it would occur to to the owners to maybe put that away Before showing, but I don’t know, maybe they forgot it was. That is so funny. Yeah, we I just I just interviewed of someone else who walked a similar story but a bit different walked in on a couple amorous scenario, which it’s that is not the first time I’ve heard that or the adults have, you know, video was was was playing in television. So it seems to, but it’s certainly certainly happens I guess,

Carrie McCormick 20:32
interesting day.

D.J. Paris 20:34
And but I also want to talk about your, the the school Sparrow project that you’re involved in. So because I know this is something you’re passionate about, and you have an event coming up. So do tell him, tell us about that.

Carrie McCormick 20:48
Yeah, thank you for mentioning that. So I’ve got two kids who went through the bell school system through the CPS system, and I work with a lot of families. And I find that this school system is a big question on a lot of parents minds. So I partnered with a website called school spiro.com. And it’s an amazing website that will help families you know, locate different schools in the city and of course, find real estate that’s in those particular school districts. And I’m also working with another company called Chicago School GPS, GPS, meaning helping you find a school that’s best suited for your your family. So we are hosting a free event in September. For those of you who want to learn more about navigating the school system, we’re going to host it at little beans cafe. And we’ve got two dates to choose from. So if you’re interested, again, it’s a free event. We’ve got a lot of great speakers coming to talk to families about schools here in Chicago and some different options that are available, I would love to be able to send you a free personal invitation for this event, you can call me which I will answer the phone, or you can email me if it’s okay, if I hand out my information real quick, please do. Sure. So my phone number is area code 312-961-4612. And my email is Carrie, C A R r i e, at 80 properties.com. So in addition to the invitation just so everyone knows, I do free home evaluations. And I also do since I have a design background, I can come into your home and give you some design tips. If you’re thinking about putting your home on the market, I can talk to you about different colors and trends and just getting your house ready for the market.

D.J. Paris 22:47
Yeah, and I would like to, to, to add to that myself, it’s just sort of all of these, these specialties really illustrate how you go above and beyond what most Realtors provide to their clients. The your expertise in, obviously, on the development side, and then and then obviously with design as well. And then doing the free web, the free seminar information with parents and schools and finding real estate. All of that is way above and beyond what most realtors are even able to provide for their for their customers,

Carrie McCormick 23:26
they don’t, I think it’s important to give back, you know, I mean, we, of course, you know, buy and sell real estate for our clients, but it’s also participating in the community and adding value to what we do.

D.J. Paris 23:39
And I think it’s not coincidental that you’ve been so successful interest in real estate in general, while also providing it with the exceptional level of customer service, and then these additional sort of knowledge pieces. So congrats to you, obviously, you don’t need my congratulations, but it’s truly impressive. And let’s see. And I would just ask if any, any other suggestions you have for people that are thinking about getting into real estate as a profession, or are already in and starting you have any suggestions of what you know what they ought to be doing on a regular basis to build their business.

Carrie McCormick 24:17
So real estate is an amazing job. I love what I do. And I think anyone who’s looking to get into the business is going to love it as well. And like I mentioned at the beginning, it’s really about working your we call it this sphere of influence your friends, your family, and just putting yourself out there. Also, I think that education is very important. So make sure that you you know sign up for any and all classes that are offered. We’ve got some amazing tools to learn. So educating yourself is also very

D.J. Paris 24:52
important. My My friend is actually Rebecca Thompson, who is the Director of Education over at our properties. Yeah, everyone loves Rebecca and, and she she is a great resource as well. But I know that properties they education is a huge, huge push. And obviously they they’ve done a great job with their brokers, including people like yourself who obviously are be having a tremendous amount of success. I think that’s really good advice. And okay, I’m gonna pause for a quick sec. I’m just trying to think if there’s anything else I think we covered pretty much everything. So yeah, is there anything I missed anything else you want me to cover?

Carrie McCormick 25:35
I don’t think so. I’ve got all my apps covered all my topics. How did I do?

D.J. Paris 25:42
Oh, you did awesome. Yeah, no, no, you did great. I’m just wanting to make sure I didn’t miss anything. Um, so I’m gonna then wrap up. I’m gonna plug your Okay, so I’m gonna do a wrap up here. And then we’ll say goodbye. So. So if you’d like to work with Carrie McCormick directly, and she is and she will make you feel like you are her only client. And her expertise speaks for itself. But if you would like to reach out to her, she can be reached, as she mentioned before and Carrie at@properties.com Or you can call her directly at 312-961-4612. She does answer the phone as she mentioned, and she’s obviously very lovely. And I don’t think you’ll be disappointed in any capacity because clearly her clients are extremely happy with her. So I know you’re incredibly busy with all of the clients you have. So taking time out of the day to speak to us is greatly appreciated. So thank you very, very much Carrie for being on the show.

Carrie McCormick 26:43
Having me loved it. Thank you

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This week we talked with Brooke Daitchman, the top individual producer at Dream Town Realty. Brooke talked about how she has grown her business over the past nine years and how last year nearly 100% of her business came from referrals. She’s a true superstar and has some amazing tips for aspiring top producers!

To contact Brooke, please email BDaitchman@dreamtown.com or call 773.412.3047.

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:16
Hello, and welcome to another episode of Keeping it real pod the first podcast for real estate agents made by real estate agents. My name is TJ Parris, and I am your host through the show. And today, we sat down with Brooke Dangerman, who I was really excited about, because, first of all, she’s incredibly busy. But also, she has just been so successful in a real estate career, she is the number one top producer at one of the largest real estate firms dream town here in Chicago. So being that the vast majority of our listeners are real estate brokers, I thought this would be in particular a special treat to hear from somebody who’s doing so well and what they do on a regular basis. And Brooke shared a lot of great techniques and tactics about how she has become successful in this business and stayed that way as well. Now, if you have somebody that you would like to hear us interview, whether it be yourself or another broker, and by the way, we’ve been getting some good suggestions from some of you. So we appreciate that. But you can actually send us a note and let us know who we need to be talking to visit keeping it real pod.com And there’s a section on there where you can suggest someone to interview so thank you again for listening. If you if you find this enjoyable, let us know either through social media, or through our website and definitely tell your fellow brokers to check it out. And again, our intention here is to make a to tell stories about what has been successful for other agents.

Today on the show, we have Brooke Daneshmand, who is a lifelong Chicago and North Shore resident real estate has always been a major passion and priority for Brooke she developed a deep rooted love of homes with all of their design and architectural potential. And following college and graduate school Brooks years spent doing marketing for Jim Beam brands, which enabled her to really learn the skill set necessary to become successful in the real estate world. She of course works with both buyers and sellers in new construction and in resales. She’s been working at Dream Town since 2008. And since her transition over to dream town, Brooke has at a remarkable trajectory. She has been recognized as a top producer by the Chicago Association of Realtors from 2009, all the way through present day, and she was also in the top 1% of sales agents in Illinois, and boasts over 180,000,450 units in career sales. And as of last year, she was the number one top producing non team broker at Dream town. And she’s Lastly, she’s been featured on HGTV S series House Hunters. So welcome, Brooke to our show. Thank you so much. Thank you. And I know you just got back from vacation. So we’ll we won’t make this too heavy, because you’re probably busy. And hopefully not it not as cloudy as I would be after a weekend or a week off. But I do want to talk a little bit about how you got into the business because you didn’t start your professional career in real estate. So could you tell us that story?

Brooke Daitchman 3:38
Um, yeah, so I actually went to college. My undergrad was in psychology. And you know, throughout my college career, I really wanted to be a psychologist. So I kind of set myself up for that. And actually, after I got out of school, went into graduate school, at Loyola University, Chicago. And quickly after entering there, I realized this was not the path I wanted to be on. However, I still wanted to help people, but I think in a different capacity. So I ended up working towards getting my real estate license. And while I was doing that, I was offered a job as a marketing specialist for Jim Beam brands, which is a very large at the time, it was the second largest liquor company in the world. And I got a great opportunity in my mid early to mid 20s with a great job. And so I actually put my real estate license on hold and I started working for them.

D.J. Paris 4:38
How that transition from working at Jim Beam to real estate sort of happened and what skills that you learned at Jim Beam?

Brooke Daitchman 4:46
Well, I think that I mean, I was so appreciative of having that opportunity. I was really green. I didn’t know a lot about business. I think that I was one of the younger people that worked for the company and I got my stuff into a pretty good position at the time. And basically, I was taught a lot about, you know, professionalism, business interaction, negotiation, building relationships, all these things that are really important. You know, in any business you’re in and in life in general, I also realized really quickly that working for corporate America in what I would consider as a little bit of a boys club, was not exactly what I wanted to do for my lifelong career. So I love the opportunity, you know, I mean, what’s not to like, you’ve got a great expense account, and you get to build all these relationships. One second, if you can hear me when you are in restaurants, you know, it was a great experience. But I realized, in order for me to excel in that business, I would have had to really sacrifice some of the things I wanted, which is, you know, my schedule and building and representing my own success. And I think that that is, it’s hard when you work in some of those big corporate America companies where, you know, you’re having to rely on a team or other people. And so I feel like that kind of was a natural progression for me too. You couple that with just the life skills, you kind of learned in being in that kind of environment. And I think that I can’t imagine not having that experience just going straight from college and getting into real estate, I feel like I would have been, I mean, you’re lost to begin with when you get into real estate. So I feel like you’d be even more lost, just, you know, you figure things out as you go. But coming in with some of that experience, I think really helped me at least, you know, put me a little bit on a pedestal where I had that experience, and then could grow and learn more of in focus on the actual real estate aspect of things.

D.J. Paris 6:51
And you came in at a particularly difficult time to be a realtor to what can we talk about that? What did that make it harder for you? Or was it easier, in some ways, because maybe a lot of brokers sort of exited the business around that time, or I imagine it would have been much harder to enter.

Brooke Daitchman 7:08
So actually, I came in, in about oh, around, around Oh, seven. And actually, you know what it was oh, six. And what happened was I started doing it part time. And I got to like a little bit of taste of it. And I’d already really wanted to get into it. And I think that little taste of it really attracted me to it. I think it attracted me like a lot of other people that are interested in real estate, I think that people see that the checks are big. And so they realize, Wow, this could be really easy money. But in all reality, if you’re only getting two or three of those checks a year, it’s not enough. So really, you know, I got a little taste of it. And I It wasn’t only that I liked the checks, I loved just kind of the transaction and the interaction and all that stuff. And so ultimately, I decided to resign from my other career and get into it full time, which was, I believe, you know, some at some point, I’d have to look back in oh six. And I got the market really went into a tailspin at the end of a wait. So I found a couple of years that were actually pretty good. Sure, which was nice. And I, I had an experience where I had done a deal with a woman who owned her own brokerage and a little boutique brokerage in Wicker Park Bucktown. And I was asked to be on her team, which as a new agent is, I think it’s even more great experience, because you’re learning from an expert, and you are learning about, you know, everything that you really need to know by people that really know what they’re doing, you know, my first transaction when I still worked at Jim Beam, literally, I took a I took a contract from another agent, and I copied it. I mean, I didn’t know what I was doing. I had no experience and, you know, I would never want to, you know, actually give that experience to a buyer or seller. I mean, I just really didn’t have any guidance at that point.

D.J. Paris 9:07
Yeah, and let’s talk about sort of the year and then so you transition to full time in around 2006 or seven is that my understand

Brooke Daitchman 9:15
your 1006 I basically left my company and I was I was invited to be on a team of a very, very successful, you know, top 10 Agent consistently in Chicago and at a Wicker Park Bucktown. Right, when that neighborhood was really starting to boom, you know, we did a lot of new development, you know, anywhere from like three to 30 units, Wicker Park Bucktown, Ukrainian village, I mean, some of the developers we worked with built that entire neighborhood.

D.J. Paris 9:43
And let’s talk about how that team experience really helped you to then go off on your own.

Brooke Daitchman 9:49
Well, just I mean, I was on that team and with that company for three years of my first serious full time three years and, you know, just learning about Bill building and selling and relationships. And you know, everything that you really need to know as an agent at that point in time was huge for me and I wasn’t building, you know, my own business necessarily. I only had, you know, a couple million in my own business really, at the time, I was building someone else’s relationships. But the learning aspect of it, I think, is what I really needed to propel myself eventually into getting to where I am now. And when the market really, really dipped, I noticed, which was an August of oh, wait, you know, I had went out of town briefly for a birthday trip. And when I got back, you know, it was like phone was ringing off the hook and then complete, you know, crickets after that. So I think what a lot of agents had to do was really shift our mentality and really change when the market really changed. And there was a really drastic cut off, and everyone’s lives changed at that point. And so I had to change as well.

D.J. Paris 11:00
Yeah. And so what do you think you did differently after the market crash that enabled you to not only survive, but to really flourish? And I mean, you’ve you’ve been so successful, you know? And so what do you think you did differently to continue to stay in the business and do so? Well?

Brooke Daitchman 11:16
Well, when the market hit, you know, hit a low point in August or September of oh, wait, I actually left and resigned from my previous company, in December of Oh, eight, and I went to dream town in January of oh nine. And what I think helped me a lot was obviously the experience I had taken. But everybody, not only myself, but every agent out there had to change their mentality and really learn about the new market and what what that was going to be and what that was going to look like. And so basically, I started over with a lot of other people that were experienced, you know, we had all these agents that were doing really, really well. And when the market went down, you know, we had to learn about short sales, and we had to learn about foreclosures, and we had to really use our relationships and really find new relationships. I think that was a huge thing is like a lot of these agents that were already successful, their clients that, you know, might have bought at the height of the market couldn’t sell. And they had to build new relationships with new people that were maybe buying and selling, that weren’t before and learn about, you know, what was happening, what was currently happening, and we really didn’t know exactly, so I left my previous company. And I started with Dream town, I was attracted to this company, because it was really a new when I say new, it was really just like a technology forward, really innovative company that provided with providing me with leads that I had never had in the past that I could build my new business from. And I think that was something that a lot of other companies didn’t offer at the time. And that for me was, you know, a home run.

D.J. Paris 12:51
Well, what I’ve always loved about about dream town in particular, is that they actually do have leads, right? So they’re about the only player out there that delivers on that promise, and a lot of places promise it and very few places can deliver dream town is that rare exception, and I’ve always admired their ability to through technology to be able to deliver leads to their brokers. So they have a great reputation.

Brooke Daitchman 13:15
Yeah, I mean, I think that again, Dream towns evolved a lot to you know, Dream town has definitely, you know, a lot of other companies have kind of jumped on that bandwagon. But when, when you know, before Redfin and really Zillow were popular dream town had the best website out there, we captured a lot of leads. And those were the new leads in the new in the new economy and in a new in a new, quote unquote, real estate business that we’re going to build my career. So what I did is just like, pick myself up by the bootstraps, and start over. And that’s what I did. So in January of Oh, nine, you know, I came to dream town, and I really just basically just started climbing out of a hole and learning about what I needed to do to be successful in that current market. And, you know, a lot of it’s trial and error, you know, you don’t know what’s going to work for you, and what works for you works for you might not work for somebody else. So you just try different things and try and evolve and, and learn from that. And so really, it was just like, one client at a time and one step at a time and just keep going.

D.J. Paris 14:18
Yeah, and I think you know, it’s it is that and and at the same point, you’ve done it so incredibly well where you’re not just the top 1%. And then with the Chicago Association, realtors, you’re literally top 1% in the state, which is even more and more remarkable. So what advice would you have for brokers that are struggling or someone maybe that’s new in the business? What sort of things habits or behaviors that really helped you that you see maybe other brokers struggling with or not doing?

Brooke Daitchman 14:48
I think that it’s really easy with our downtime and our own schedules to kind of go play and you know, not stay consistent and I think consistency is probably one of the hugest things, as agents, we need to do, you know, always following up with people and always staying consistent. I mean, I found myself doing it as well, you know, but I think the consistency is really good. I think educating yourself on the current market that you’re in is really helpful. You know, none of us have a crystal ball, none of us can tell, you know, what your house is going to be worth in five years, but what we can do is know what’s currently happening and maybe know about some of the trends that we’ve seen. And I think that’s something that’s really helpful, I think, you know, educating ourselves on the market, you know, and I think just little things, like having a really good moral compass, people can sniff that out and smell it, you know, if you’re an agent that carries contracts in the back of your car, and it’s like, I think you need to buy this, you know, that’s probably not the best thing for somebody. So I think those are all things that kind of lend to being a good agent and giving you know, somebody that’s new, some sort of starting point.

D.J. Paris 15:59
Yeah. 100% agree. And it seems to be consistent. What you just said, among, among all the top producers that I’ve talked to over the years, and let’s talk about specifically about how you got on television, because that’s always interesting. How did you get involved with HDTV? Um, you know, I

Brooke Daitchman 16:16
just got, you know, someone at my old company had told me that they were looking for somebody that was buying in the Bucktown. area. And you know, that you I asked some clients, we kind of fell into what they were looking for. And I had asked some clients if they were interested, and you kind of got a set of videos or clients and a view. And anyway, it worked out where all the pieces kind of fell together. And so yeah, we take we take that I think it was in around, probably, oh, oh, wait. Oh, 708. So it was a while ago, it was a fun experience. You know, I’d never really besides the Bozo show, I hadn’t really been on TV. I think it was one of those things like I can check that box. I don’t know if I necessarily would want to do it again, people don’t realize that like, for a half hour show, you’ve done you know, 25 hours of taping. It’s just a lot of like cutting and editing and doing over and doing over. And so it was a cool experience. It’s fun to do. It’s funny to for me to look back on it because I look at myself. I said, wow, it was so young. But it was cool. And it was it was a fun experience for sure.

D.J. Paris 17:27
Did did it result in any new clients as a result of whoever saw your your episode?

Brooke Daitchman 17:33
Well, frankly, not really. It was interesting, because it aired on a special Chicago week. So it aired multiple multiple times over and over over the next couple of years after it was filmed. And I got a lot of people texting and emailing me and calling me even some people I didn’t want to hear from, you know, strange, interesting people all over the country and world. But no, not necessarily business. I don’t I didn’t get any, you know, real serious business from it. But I didn’t do it for that I did it as a fun experience to kind of, you know, to do in my life.

D.J. Paris 18:09
Yeah, for sure. And speaking of fun experiences, you just told us about some experiences you’ve had just in working with clients walking in on a naked people. What was that? What was the circumstances around that?

Brooke Daitchman 18:23
Oh, gosh, um, you know, I think in real estate, if you’re in it long enough, you always have, you know, kind of funny, quirky stories of things that happen over the years. If we get into discussions, we kind of start talking about it. Yeah, I think I mean, I’ve walked in on naked people in bed, I’ve walked out, you know, I’ve walked in on a lot of things I’ve had, I’ve been locked in an elevator at a showing where we’ve actually had to have the fire department come and get us out. And I was so proud to say that we didn’t even miss one of our showings after that. So it was, it was a pretty crazy experience. You know, the other agents started kind of getting all panicky and, you know, I’ve had clients, you know, have to get out of my car and get sick on Wall Street and in a flower bush.

D.J. Paris 19:10
After after a night of imbibing too much or just sick from

Brooke Daitchman 19:13
client’s father and I think he had the flu and he just No, can you pull over and I know what he’s talking about. And we’re like, you know, middle of the day busy Well, street and Old Town and well, there he goes. So and I was just like, you know, maybe I should drop you off. Maybe I should drop you off at home.

D.J. Paris 19:30
Did he? Did he keep going or did you end up dropping?

Brooke Daitchman 19:33
You know, like I was like, flushed and you know, doing so well. So we’re like, Well, why don’t you go home? So yeah, I mean, I think you start to acquire a lot of little, you know, stories that kind of happen over the years and stuff like that. I think one of my favorite things about you know, being in this business is just I’ve you know, now that I’ve been in it for as long as I have seeing, you know, some of my clients lives evolve which is really Cool, you know, I think that I have clients that I’ve met like right before they’ve gotten married. And then, you know, last year, I helped people that I knew right before they got married, actually, now they have three kids, and by their, you know, fifth property for me and have a totally different life, it’s really cool to just see how you’re helping people’s lives evolve and change and how your clients are growing. And I really liked that about it.

D.J. Paris 20:23
Yeah, and then, you know, sort of speaking of life events, or rather, you know, in your case, you have family that’s also involved in real estate, your grandparents, were they both in the business or

Brooke Daitchman 20:33
well, so it’s funny, you know, how I got into the business, how I really fell in love with real estate, as my mother was that person who like was the annoying person who walked into every open house and dragged me with them on the weekend and pretended she was going to buy the house that you know, she was not going to buy. Sure. So my mom used to drag me to open houses, and I just loved it, you know, I loved seeing the properties and seeing how different they were. And so that’s where I kind of fell into it. But when I told my mother when I was leaving graduate school that I wanted to be in real estate, you know, my family wasn’t exactly excited. I have had a grandmother on both sides that were realist in the real estate business, real estate agents, and you know, one of which wasn’t very successful and was always kind of struggling. So I think that they had, were nervous, were nervous about it. And what I can say now is that actually, last year, you know, I got my sister into a full time, which is really exciting, because now my mother has two daughters that are in real estate. And it’s kind of a family affair. But, you know, I think that I wanted to get my sister in it, because I saw you know, how brilliant she was. And I thought that she would, it would be a really good fit. And I would like to, you know, build my business and, you know, hopefully, in the future, pass

D.J. Paris 21:48
it on to her. Is she so she’s working with you at the moment or work with me? Yes. Oh, that’s, that is? That’s a lot of fun. Yeah. It’s totally

Brooke Daitchman 21:57
great. And knowing that, you know, you can completely rely on somebody, I mean, you know, it’s hard to find people that are on the same same wavelength is you and the same, that, you know, carry the same expectations with what they want to get done. And, you know, when you know, someone really well, it’s easily I’m sure it can go the other way and have be a disaster. But it’s been, you know, a year and a half so far, and it’s been really great.

D.J. Paris 22:22
That yeah, that is that is really cool. I’m going down to see my sister this weekend, she just had her first baby. And she’s, yeah, she’s in marketing, I’m in marketing, and although we’re in totally different industries, but it would be very cool to be able to work with with my sister, unfortunately, it probably won’t ever happen, just geography and also our industries are different, but But I imagine that must be pretty rewarding to be able to, you know, sort of mentor your sister and and help her build that business, and then eventually, maybe turn it over. With the oh, I wanted to talk more about the consistency, you said that was sort of the key, in your opinion that what got you through the more difficult times? And could you talk a little bit more about like, what is your average? I know, every day is different, but are there any daily habits or consistent behaviors that you’re doing to ensure that you’re always, you know, looking for new clients or, you know, servicing your existing clients in a way that’s, you’re like, Okay, well, every day, I try to duck out a couple of things pretty regularly.

Brooke Daitchman 23:20
Um, so I, you know, obviously, consistency, I, you know, I’m I’m always responding to emails and phone calls and text messages, you know, as quickly as possible. I think just people hearing for me, I mean, if I had clients that didn’t hear from me for a day or two, they would probably think something happened to me, if you know, if they reached out to me, is what I mean. Just because I’m very consistent about getting back to people very rarely will I miss an email and, you know, respond in three or four days. And usually it’s if I’m on vacation or something, but that’s obviously the first part of being consistent I, what I what I’ve been trying to do is, you know, send out letters and just notes to clients that I haven’t talked to in a while, what we call touching them and I hate to use that term, but you know, just sure, in some way touching a client that you haven’t heard from just to say hello, or you know, buy him a coffee or something like that. I think that as far as relationship building is the most consistent thing you can do. And so I think that’s, that’s important. I’m, I’m kind of not the best person as far as organization. So number one, having somebody that helps keep me organized, but I’m also I kind of liked this business because not every day is the same. You know, I like it because, you know, one day I might have showings with buyers all day and then I have listing showings or then I have a listing presentation or then you know, every day you wake up and you do different stuff, and I appreciate that because I know one of my first jobs out of college was in a company where I was nine to five sitting at a desk, someone watching over my shoulder and it for me it did not work. And I think, as we’ve seen, you know, kind of our, you know, business economy evolved, that’s changed a lot. And what’s what’s happening in a lot of big companies now. So a lot of people were or were able to work from home and you know, there’s a little more flexibility with things. And I could not wake up every day and do the same exact thing. I think I would go crazy.

D.J. Paris 25:20
What percentage of your business these days would you say is referral based, you know, either existing clients that are now doing another transaction or referrals from those, you know, friends and family of those people? What percentage of your business would you say is that

Brooke Daitchman 25:36
well, so I actually, we last year was my best year of real estate ever. And I was actually the number one agent in my company, individual agent, not on a team, which was a really great success. For me, I was really proud of that. When we looked at my year and review this year, about 99, almost 100% of it was referral based. It was either coming from reviews from people or coming from an old client, or, yeah, I mean, those two things. It was a Yeah, 100% referral, I don’t do online leads anymore. I don’t I don’t get them anymore. What I would say is that I looked at my business to about half and half buyer seller. So it was just really interesting to kind of look back. That being said, as our business is very cyclical, you know, the people that your past clients, when they’re buying things, they’re probably not going to buy for another, you know, for six years, or they might be in there forever home. So it’s important to just continue to keep building those relationships, and, you know, building new ones. And I think that as an agent is one of the hardest things we can do is continually try to find and build new relationships out there.

D.J. Paris 26:47
Yeah, no, you’re absolutely it’s so interesting National Association realtors, they did this study a couple years ago, it was like October of 2015, when they released it. And it was sort of hard to kind of pour through the data. I looked through it just to see if I could glean any sort of interesting statistics to read to really I don’t think I have talked about this at all. But one of the more interesting statistics was they they surveyed hundreds or maybe probably 1000s of buyers and sellers, in particular ones that were not first time homebuyers. So somebody that had done some transaction in the past, and was now on their next transaction. And this study was was looking at was people who were not first time homebuyers who now were in the same geographic area, they weren’t moving to another state or even city. But what percentage of those people use their previous realtor? It was I would have guessed, if you would have asked me, What would you think I’d say probably 50%. Or that sounds about right. To me. It was like in the low 90s. So like 90 something percent, let’s just say 90%. I think it was 93% of all of those people surveyed, even you know, use that existing realtor before. So you know, you talked about now 100% of your business and your, you know, just about 10 years in is really the referral base. It truly is remarkable how once if they have a good experience, and it seems like you do a good job, you know, they’re just going to stick with you for life, assuming you stay in touch and, and clearly that’s been working for you quite well.

Brooke Daitchman 28:10
Yeah. I mean, I think in any business, you have your, your successes and you know, sometimes disappointments, I mean, this business just like any other one, you know, you’ll go out on a listing appointment, and you think it went really well. And you know, you don’t get it. I mean, that’s part of the business.

D.J. Paris 28:27
You know, it’s so interesting, because, you know, we interview a lot of people, we don’t interview a lot of brokers who are really number one at their company, in particular, a large company like dream town, it’s certainly not a small boutique brokerage firm. There’s hundreds of brokers, if not probably over 1000. Now, they have a huge thing. So you know, your words hopefully have reverberated out among the broker community, who are the majority of people listen, but also, sometimes clients listened. So we you know, if you’re at all interested in working with Brooke, you should get in touch with her. Her website is Brooke sells chicago.com. And that redirects you to her Facebook page, which also is one way to get in touch with her. And then Brooke, what is your best phone number? If a client wants to work with you,

Brooke Daitchman 29:13
773-412-3047 you’ll find me direct

D.J. Paris 29:19
and who better to work with and the number one producer at a pretty big company, she’s definitely must be doing a good job. You know, almost all of her business is referral which pretty much says it all. So we really appreciate your time. I know how busy you are. And I know that this was riddled with a few glitches along the way. So I appreciate all your energy and time and patience. And thank you so much for being part of the show.

Brooke Daitchman 29:43
Yeah, thank you, DJ for having me. I’ll look forward to connecting with you in the future.

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How is the current political climate going to affect tax reform, and what does that mean for your buyers and sellers? Also, did you know that you have access to a trove of tools to help your business courtesy of the Illinois REALTORS®? We speak with Beth Wanless who lobbies on your behalf and protects your interests. Our most timely episode to date!

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:15
Hello, and welcome to keeping it real podcast, the first podcast for real estate agents made by real estate agents. My name is DJ Paris, I am your host through the show. And today on the show, we’re doing something a little different. We normally highlight realtors, and who have had success and in the specific area, and we interview them and find out exactly what they’re doing and hopes that you can learn from that and maybe even replicate what their behavior is. So you can get those same results, but did today, we because of the current climate around some of the potential tax changes that are going into effect. And we wanted to find someone who’s on the front line working for you, to help you understand exactly what’s going on out there that you can communicate to your clients. So today we have Beth Wanless from the Illinois Association of Realtors, she is basically a lobbyist for you, making sure that your your needs are being met, and that your voices are being heard with various parts of the government. And we talked a lot about how the potential tax law change or rather the potential tax changes that may be implemented shortly how those would affect realtors, and how those affect developers and buyers and sellers. And also, we talked about a lot of the resources that the Illinois Association of Realtors has for brokers that you probably don’t know exists. These are, you’re already paid for these as part of your dues to your local MLS. And you have access to some really wonderful tools. And so Beth is going to talk about some of those tools so that you can utilize them to of course, you know, better meet your client’s needs. So without further ado, I’m going to launch into our our interview and I hope you find it very interesting. Oh, I’m sorry, one last thing. If you haven’t yet visited our website, which is keeping it real pod.com You can go there and stream all of our previous episodes. You can also of course, subscribe on iTunes, Google Play, anywhere podcasts are served. And listen to those episodes. Also, if you have someone that you think we should be interviewing could even be yourself. Are you somebody who always wanted to hear how they built their business or what they’re doing in a specific area? You can let us know right on our website. And we also have, of course, a Facebook page too. But visit keeping it real pod.com and let us know any feedback you have. We would be curious to hear it. We want to make the show better and better just for you. By the way, as you as you’re listening to this interview with Beth, if you’re curious about how do I actually meet some of these government employees that are working on my behalf for my industry? Well, they have an event every once a month, every first Tuesday. So the next one if you’re listening currently, the next one is coming up August 1 But it’s the first Tuesday of every month it is at the National Association of REALTORS building. Also Chicago association of realtors office which is 430 North Michigan on the eighth floor, they do quotes called Coffee with your GA D which is government affairs directors. So this is a place where you can go you can learn what the government professionals are doing for you on your behalf Have some coffee, get an update to on all things public policy in Chicago and Cook County this is free for all members. So Okay, enjoy our interview.

Today on the show, we have Beth Wanless, who is the local government affairs director and regional manager of member outreach with the Illinois Realtors Association. Beth works in the Chicago office and works also with the Cook County Board of Commissioners, the Metropolitan Water Reclamation district among other elected officials and community members about this experience on both the federal and the state level. She was a congressional intern for a former US Representative from California and an intern for the former attorney general of West Virginia native Ohioan. Beth was a senior staffer for an Ohio House of Representatives Majority Whip, I still have never figured out exactly what the majority whip is. But um, maybe you can explain that at some point. Before returning back to the policy world. Beth was a research analyst in a corporate development group of private investment for a private investment firm in Chicago. She graduated from Denison University I’ve been to Denison and from also from Northwestern. Beth has lived in Chicago for more than a decade and currently resides in Ravenswood with her husband and two young sons. So welcome and thank you for being on our podcast.

Beth Wanless 4:48
Well, thank you so much. I’d really happy to be here.

D.J. Paris 4:51
That is a really impressive introduction and resume tell us how did you how did you get moved to Chicago or how did you it seems Where are you from originally, actually,

Beth Wanless 5:01
Oh, great question. I grew up in Columbus, Ohio, big Buckeye fan. So I hope, a good company.

D.J. Paris 5:08
And you went and you went to college, like 30 minutes away. That was as far as you got.

Beth Wanless 5:12
Right? I would go to Ohio State Buckeye games on the weekends. So I was I was close enough to do that. But yeah, I grew up in Columbus, Ohio. My parents were not involved in politics or public policy, I just kind of fell into it. I thought it was fascinating. I’m a big history nerd. And I think if you’re a history nerd than politics, just as kind of a natural progression for you. I got into politics, they’re working in the Ohio House of Representatives. And then I don’t know what happened. I just was young and, you know, hungry for adventure. So I said, heck with it, I’m just gonna pick up everything I quit my job, gave my two weeks notice, excuse me, and then I moved to Chicago with no job, no job prospects, and literally two suitcases and my dog and found myself employed a couple of months later for the Crown family, and they were wonderful to work with. And then I realized that finance was not my, my forte, and then I wanted to get back into public policy. So I started working with the Institute of real estate management, which is a national affiliate of the National Association of Realtors. And it’s a funny story, I actually got offered two job offers on the same day, that makes me sound really, you know, extraordinarily wonderful. But it was just happenstance. And I am not extraordinarily wonderful. But one was in healthcare, and one was for real estate. And I remember saying to my boyfriend at the time, who’s currently my husband, that man healthcare, it’s it’s such a big industry right now with the Affordable Care Act passing in, there’s so much there’s so much room to grow in this industry. But I said to myself, I love real estate, and I love private property rights. And that’s just something that I could do forever. And it has really grown into a fantastic career. So a couple of months ago, I was working on an issue in Illinois rent control, which I’ll talk about later in a minute. And I was working with Illinois, real tours, and my colleague, Brian Berger, Tony, who I’m sure many folks who listen to this podcast know. So hey, why don’t you come work for us? So he, he invited me to go through the application process. And long story short, here I am. I just started June 1.

D.J. Paris 7:32
Oh, wow. You are new to the physician but not new to the not new to the type of position I guess. Right. So yeah, let’s talk a little bit about your your role. What do you do specifically at IR?

Beth Wanless 7:47
Great question. So I am the government affairs professional, also known as lobbyist. I know some people don’t like that word. But you know, that’s what I do. I lobby, the Cook County Board of Commissioners. And they also lobby the water reclamation district. My colleague, Brian does city council. So he works with all the older men and other community officials. But we are a pretty good team. Obviously, I’ve only been here for a couple of weeks. But I’ve known him before that. And it was just like, an excellent fit for me. And I was pretty excited to have the opportunity. Yeah, I

D.J. Paris 8:22
know, there’s a lot going on right now. And yet, let’s let’s jump into it. So what I know you wanted to talk a lot about some of the legislative moves that may or may not be happening. So to start, I don’t know, let’s I know, you had even talked about federal, state and local levels. I don’t know let’s Shall we start big to small start at federal and then sort of narrow it down? And just basically stuff that brokers would want to know. And how to plan maybe more effectively for their, their business in the upcoming year years, as well as what to expect from their clients and that sort of thing?

Beth Wanless 8:59
Sure. Yeah. So big to small let’s do federal first. Well, first things first, a real tours are always watching out for their members best interests. Excuse me, and Illinois, we have 14 Government Affairs officials. So literally every edge of this state is being monitored, to make sure that our members interests are being represented. And that’s the same thing on the federal level as well. I worked with the NAR policy staff pretty closely, and they are some of the most talented professionals in the industry. And I’m sure again, anybody who has spoken with them or worked with them knows that firsthand. So tax reform, tax reform, tax reform, I know this is kind of a boring topic. And I admit it’s not one that I’m an expert in Evan Lydiard is the tax guru at NAR but um, there are a couple of things that we are really watching, or I should say they are watching very closely. Tax reform has been on the forefront of both administration’s agenda when the Democrats and Republicans were running for the presidential seat, people were talking about tax reform while it has come into play. Now, obviously, there’s no legislation pending. But we are gearing up for that. So what does that mean? Well, we want to retain a 1031. Like kind exchange. And that’s a big one for commercial investors. It just allows the investor to defer emphasis on defer, they do pay. They do pay taxes on the gain of the sale of a property if they purchase a similar property. And we also want to retain them.

D.J. Paris 10:41
By the way, Beth, I’m sorry. Sorry, did Rob is that in danger of possibly going away?

Beth Wanless 10:47
It sure is, unfortunately, we have heard a lot of rumblings. And again, I have not been in contact with members of Congress since coming here very closely. So I have heard rumblings at 1031 will be on the chopping block. And that tool has been around in the revised code for I want to say almost 100 years. So that has been a tool for real estate investors since the 20s. And they’re saying that that’s they want to get rid of it. Both Democrats and Republicans have been talking about getting rid of that tax deductions. That’s a great question. So we want to retain that. We also want to retain the mortgage interest deduction, I’m sure

D.J. Paris 11:26
that’s the big one. That’s at least the big one that affects not just investors.

Beth Wanless 11:31
But exactly it’s it’s a huge one. I’m not as familiar with this tax provision as a 1031 exchange. But I have learned very, very quickly that that is the number one priority when tax reform comes to the forefront that they want to protect. And we have heard from elected officials that they are going to retain this. But they aren’t in some ways, because the last tax issue dimension is the potential elimination of the state and local tax deduction. That’s really bad. It basically negates the mortgage interest deduction, right, it would hurt the states with the highest tax burdens, as they wouldn’t be able to deduct property taxes from their federal taxes. And since it’s a double taxation, like I said, a lot of elected officials in Congress said that MIT is safe. But by doubling the standard deduction that Americans can take, the lower their taxable income, the mid would be significantly less valuable. And that’s just because homeowners can take advantage of the mid if they don’t use the standard deduction, and instead, itemized deductions. It’s a little confusing, but rest assured our lobbyists in DC are working really, really hard to make sure that members of Congress understand how important these tax provisions are.

D.J. Paris 12:52
Is there a certain is is one of the parties more looking to in Illinois, at least, as far as the you know, either retaining or getting rid of the state and local tax? Is that a party issue? Or is it? Is it? Is it contingent upon other factors versus just whether someone’s a Republican or Democrat?

Beth Wanless 13:14
Yeah, it’s really contingent on a lot of factors. You know, retaining the 1031 like kind exchange historically has been a Republican issue. However, with the Republican in office in the executive branch and legislative branch. It’s kind of ironic that they’re targeting that. So it is there are a lot of things at play. I think a lot of constituents across many districts want to see change. And that’s what they’re giving them. And unfortunately, it’s at the at the sacrifice of our members and homeowners across the nation. So great question, but there are many, many factors at play here.

D.J. Paris 13:53
And what what do we what does your office think would happen? Should the state and local tax deductions whether they go away or whether they negate the mortgage interest deduction? What what do you guys project as far as how that affects homeowners who are thinking about buying or investors who are thinking about continuing to invest?

Beth Wanless 14:15
Right, right. I mean, it definitely causes pause for a lot of people who would otherwise be very much encouraged by that, by that tax provision, that tax tool, it helps lower income and middle income Americans afford their house payments, and afford homeownership. And as we all know, homeownership is a core sort of the community a lot of communities do well and thrive when people own homes. And when there’s, you know, home sales and activity. I when I was interviewing for this position, I I’m really good friends with an NAR policy staffer, and she was telling me we’re I don’t know what we were talking about. She was saying we’re kind of like arguing about something and she said, You know what, Beth? Real tours do not I buy and sell houses and flip them to make a buck. They buy and sell houses to build communities. And she believed that and so do I. And I believe that if these tax provisions are changed in a negative way that homeownership will not be what it is today. And it’s very important to retain that economic tool, because it creates jobs, it creates stability, it creates safety, so many things, so many positive things come out of homeownership, and the communities that have homeownership.

D.J. Paris 15:36
Yeah, thanks. That’s, that’s a really good answer. And let’s also let’s talk about rent control. You mentioned that earlier. I know that’s been on a lot of realtors, certainly on a lot of investors minds, but most of them are represented by Realtors as well. So what what, uh, what’s going on with rent control right now?

Beth Wanless 15:52
Well, rent control was introduced by a state representative from the city area Wilgus. Already, he I believe, represents Logan Square, and they have they have a problem with gentrification. Or so the constituents say, and how, you know, housing prices are increasing, rent is increasing. So he introduced a piece of legislation that would repeal the ban on rent control in the state of Illinois. And that’s actually when I got pretty involved because I typically do federal stuff. But when I saw that I was like, Oh, crap, you know, let’s, let’s see what’s going on. And I started talking to the Illinois realtors and trying to figure out what exactly this meant was this going to pass? There’s a ton of research out there, excuse me, that talks about how bad rent control is. And we’re not talking about just for the economy, but we’re talking about lower income Americans. And it’s a noble gesture, rent control. It really is. And I appreciate what they’re trying to do with that with that legislation, but it actually does the opposite. So it sort of creates a black market that really only wealthy renters can should know about. It doesn’t help anybody who needs the apartment. I think there was a study that was done with the American Association of economists, or the something like that, that NAR did a few years ago, and 93% of the economists surveyed in this group said that rent control lowers the quality and quantity of affordable housing. So if that doesn’t tell you something I don’t know, what does. I’m not an economist, but I have to believe what they’re saying is true. And, you know, we’ve seen other situations where rent control backfires. And it really just, like I said, creates a black market. investors don’t come in and build properties, because they don’t see that they can charge market rents. A lot of landlords can’t fix up a unit because they just don’t have the money to do it because they can’t charge market rents. A lot of problems with rent control. It’s it’s a huge thing. I’m not the state lobbyists, but I’ve been told by your lobbyists that they’re obviously going to monitor any other movement on a similar piece of legislation. Because it is such a big thing for our members. Not only our members but for renters and the people who need affordable housing.

D.J. Paris 18:28
Yeah, I’ve heard as of about a month or so ago, someone who was monitoring the or maybe it was lobbying directly was thought was confident that that might get defeated. But I don’t know if that’s beneficial.

Beth Wanless 18:46
Yes, yeah, it is dead. Although in public policy, we can never really count anything out because the 11th hour or something can always happen. But um, it is dead for right now. However, like I said, our lobbyists Greg and Julie down in Springfield, they are watching very, very closely to make sure that they’re educating the the members of the House and Senate in in Springfield about what rent control really does and what it doesn’t do. It doesn’t help housing affordability at all. So great question on that one.

D.J. Paris 19:19
And then lastly, let’s talk about the local legislative potential changes, you know, you mentioned or you you sent to me some information about recycling landlord tenant ordinances. Can you speak briefly on this?

Beth Wanless 19:32
Yeah, great question. So on a local level. This was before I came to Illinois realtors, but there was a city ordinance passed that basically requires landlords and condo association managers and HOA managers to it’s for four or more units. That’s important to notice. For more units or kind of association, you to post a sign about the source separated recycling law and source separated means one bin for plastic one bin for metal one bin for paper, a landlord must provide the recycling containers and posts a list of acceptable items. And they also must be maintained. So they have to be emptied and they can’t stink or anything like that. And then you also have to educate your tenants on recycling and how they participate. The violations are pretty hefty for it, they range from 500 to 1000 for the first offense, and then I think up to like 5000 bucks, so it’s kind of serious, you definitely want to stay on top of it. My my colleague, Brian burger, God did a fantastic job of working with city council to put a 30 day warning of non compliance in there. So there is that. But I would encourage all Community Association managers, all landlords to know what this law is, and get things straightened out because it’s, it can be pretty expensive if you don’t abide by it. Another issue that we are monitoring closely is the residential landlord tenant ordinance. My colleague, Brian has been working with city council on an amendment to the RL to regarding judicial discretion on security deposits. So a lot of our members tell me, hey, you know, the security deposit law here is just crazy. Like, if we’re one penny off on returning the money to a tenant, we have to pay two times the deposit amount plus interest, there’s no wiggle room at all. Unfortunately, there’s no judicial discretion. So judges have to give the ruling that the landlord or the property owner must pay that amount. In some cases, it can be 10s of 1000s of dollars for just one penny off in returning the security deposit amount. So my colleague, Brian is, like I said, working with city council to get a very, very, very small change to the ordinance, just so we can give judges some discretion. Because obviously, we do want bad actors to be held accountable for taking advantage of the system. So that’s a that’s a great one. And I’ve been a renter, almost my entire life. So I definitely understand the issue. But it’s it’s a little stretch right now. So we want the judges to have some flexibility and wiggle room there.

D.J. Paris 22:28
Perfect. Yeah, that’s the I hear that a lot, too. I know that there’s a lot of debate among well, not only the tenants but of course, the the landlords and and investors around what to do with security deposit, should they even have a security deposit or so they just started to move in fee, because the security deposits are so problematic, or can be problematic if it’s not done? You know, obviously, exactly right. Let’s talk about the different resources that realtors have that they might not know that they have with your organization. And there are a bunch of really important resources. So let’s talk about and I know this is one that sort of really important to our firm as well, which is the Legal Hotline, which I suspect most brokers aren’t super familiar with. And it’s an incredibly useful resource. And it’s, well, I You could argue it’s free, it’s part of your dues, but it’s certainly much cheaper than going out and hiring somebody for, you know, $400 an hour. Do you guys have a staff of attorneys whose job it is, is to basically man a hotline and answer any and all questions related to brokers transactions or clients? Right. I know we as a as a firm, contact the Legal Hotline, probably we have 550 brokers. So we have a lot of there’s a lot of always a lot of questions we could ask, but we call in just to make sure we’re doing everything appropriately and not missing anything. And we are we probably call a few times a week. But what you know, can we talk more about what they offer or why a realtor themselves might need to call the Legal Hotline?

Beth Wanless 24:09
Oh, gosh, um, let’s see. That’s a good question. So like you said, I think the best use of the Legal Hotline is just to ensure compliance. Because you do not want to do anything illegal, of course. But like you said, just calling to make sure that things are going smoothly that you’re doing the right thing. I’m not very familiar with what types of issues they they work on. I think just you know, licensed law compliance. Yeah, fair housing.

D.J. Paris 24:39
Yeah, any anytime a broker finds himself saying, I just want to double check, right? When it’s potentially a legal issue. I’ll give you a really practical example that we are constantly checking for our brokers, which is if they create their own marketing, for example, like maybe they create their own custom website, and we actually build custom websites for our brokers but some also then go off on their own and build their own. Or maybe it’s a specific flyer, that or some sort of digital marketing piece even. And, you know, it’s interesting because if if if a broker goes and tries to read the advertising guidelines, they’re somewhat vague, not super easy to follow. And there’s questions sometimes where you just want to double check to make sure do I need to I need the full firm office address? Do I need the firm’s phone number? I know I need my phone number. But do I, I know I have to name the firm. But do I have to say the actual physical location of the year things like that, and obviously, a realtor should should feel free to contact their own managing broker who should be somewhat knowledgeable. But if you want to double check, you know, the Legal Hotline is perfect for those kinds of things. And we are constantly sending over and here’s a piece of marketing that one of our brokers put together, is there anything unusual or an because some of you know that it is to some degree open for interpretation, a little bit of that of the way that it’s worded. So that’s a perfect reason to or if there’s a maybe in a dispute where someone’s having an issue, a broker’s having an issue with maybe the broker on the other end of the deal. And they’re just want to make sure that they’re not or rather, can I say this to my client? Can I, you know, that sort of thing. It’s an incredible resource, and it’s easy to get access. So sometimes people will say, Well, how do I find that? I mean, probably the easiest way is just Google legal hotline, Illinois realtor, or you could just go to the Illinois realtor website. And it’s right there. Very easy to find. Yeah, I’m

Beth Wanless 26:31
actually really excited to hear that you use it so often. I didn’t even know this existed until I joined the organization. And then I heard it, I was like, oh, surely that’s not for any managing broker. That would be crazy. That would be so much work, but it is it’s it’s a great member benefit and a resource that is like you said, it’s free. But I mean, it pays for itself and you know, one or two uses, so Oh my

D.J. Paris 26:56
gosh. And let’s let’s talk about Inman Inman News. So

Beth Wanless 27:02
yeah, that’s it’s essentially just a free subscription, the Inman select. So I have this handy brochure. But if you go to the website, which is Illinois, real tours.org. And then you click on the left side, and it says member benefits. See it is on the very bottom, if you’re already signed into your account, when you click on the link under Inman, you have free access, it’ll go like, Oh, please try this. And then it goes right into your free account. So then you register you sign up, and it gives you a bunch of information and news. And I think someone told me it was valued this subscription, and then select is valued at $220. So

D.J. Paris 27:48
Oh, yeah. Inman is an incredible source of of real real estate information. It’s probably the about the best source out there, or at least, oh, I mean, it’s certainly right up there, as far as you know, consistently, good content that’s relevant to a realtor, and they have just a lot of great, great content. So yeah, if you haven’t signed up for that, you have a subscription through the Illinois, you know, Realtors Association, and then let’s talk about lobbyists. And you’re on that team as well. You know, there’s, there’s a, there’s a 14 of you that are out to protect Realtors interests. And, you know, what, if realtors are looking to make their voices heard, you know, how would they go about making sure that they know what you know that you know, what they’re looking for and what they need?

Beth Wanless 28:37
Sure, like you said, 14 lobbyists, I don’t know any other association is as organized as Illinois. That’s not to say that the other realtor associations are not terrific. They absolutely are. But it really is a unique model. And I’ve gotten a lot of compliments on how Illinois does it. We have lobbyists throughout the state. So there, let’s see three in Springfield. And then there’s our boss, Mike, who kind of oversees all the local government affairs directors, or GADS or what they’re called. And if you ever want to contact somebody, or if you ever have an issue, I mean, they deal with issues every day, from city council to, you know, whatever zoning all kinds of stuff. If you ever want to contact somebody, go to the website, Illinois realtors.org. And then click on About us. And then you’ll see staff, and then government affairs staff, and it’ll give you direct access to any of us. And I will I’m even happy to give out my cell phone number. Because the way that we can do our jobs best is by hearing by members because we’re not practitioners. You know, I’m not out in field buying and selling homes. So I’m not seeing what our members are running into. As far as policy issues or legal issues or whatever. So please contact us. That’s the best way for us to do our job and to protect the members, the members in their industry. So I if you’d like I can give out my cell phone number. Anybody wants to reach me? Yeah, it’s 312-758-6644. Again, my name is Beth Wanless. All the gadgets are available at your disposal, we work hard, we work a lot of hours. And, you know, we just want to make sure that our members feel like they’re being represented. And obviously, we want to see projects through not only do we monitor stuff, but we need to move things. And we can really only do that when we know about it. And we can hear from your experiences. So good

D.J. Paris 30:48
question. And let’s end with a couple of to do’s that realtors can immediately engage in to get more involved or get more information. I know you’re talking about with

Beth Wanless 31:01
Yes, the realtor party mobile alerts are pretty cool. So if you’re listening to this, and you have a handy cell phone, or I should say a cell phone handy, text, realtor, r e a l t o r 230644. Again, type in the number 30644. And in the message area, put in real tour push son, and then it will sign you up for a mobile alert. So the last time the National Association of REALTORS initiated a call for action was I believe, last year in 2016. And that was for a bill hr 3700. I think it was the housing opportunities through Modernization Act. So a politician was talking to one of our federal lobbyists, and he said, You know, I know I see what this bill does, and it does good things. But we just want to know that your members care. So chief lobbyists went back and said, Let’s do a call for action. And so they mobilized this mobile alert that was sent out to cell phones and emails to 1.3 million realtor members. And I want to say they got 220,000 messages from Realtors across the country saying please pass this bill. What did they do? They passed it unanimously. I don’t know when the last time that happened in Congress, which all Democrats and all Republicans voted to pass something. But I have to say that that was quite remarkable and pretty exciting. So I know. Yeah, like I said, 220,000 people responded to this call for action. So it’s a simple way that you can get involved, you don’t have to do anything, we will send you the alerts. So if you can just text real tour, get the number, just make sure I’m giving it to you correctly.

D.J. Paris 32:57
30644, there you go. Yeah, text the word realtor to 30644. And they are not going to send too many messages once in a while. But it’s really critical. I just signed up myself. And then let’s, let’s end with talking about our pack,

Beth Wanless 33:14
or pack. So are basically just helps raise and spend money to elect candidates who understand the importance of the real estate industry, to the economy and to the community. The money is voluntarily invested in it’s very wisely used. So I’m a major investor, that just means that I invested $1,000 of my own money into our PAC. I personally really do believe in the power of our I believe in our PAC, I’ve heard a lot of stories on how it works on the federal, state and local level. And it’s it’s actually pretty incredible. I don’t think it’s the largest PAC out there. I don’t want to give you bad information, but it’s certainly one of the most powerful and the arkpak staffers are terrific. They work really hard at identifying candidates who understand our issues. And if you are interested in learning more or getting involved, please visit our PAC now.com It’s www dot our PAC now.com

D.J. Paris 34:21
RPAC

Beth Wanless 34:22
RP. Yes, RP ac now.com. And I should also mention if there are any magic brokers out there anybody listening who are interested in having me or a colleague, who maybe is closer to them come to your office, I will bring coffee and donuts and I will talk for 10 minutes and just tell you about these resources and tell you how to find them. I know it’s a little tricky over a podcast but I would be more than happy to come to you introduce myself and see how we can ensure that you’re using these terrific member benefits because they really are I mean worth their weight in gold. It’s incredible, like Inman and the legal hotline and we even have some forms on there that you can use like a sample office policy. So please, please, please, if you’re a realtor, remember, visit the Illinois real tours.org website and learn about what we’re doing for you.

D.J. Paris 35:19
And if you want to reach out to Beth directly, her email is B Wanless, which is B as in boy and then w a n l e. S S at Illinois realtors.org. And definitely, in particular, if you’re a managing broker and you’d like her to come speak, shoot her a message or really Beth’s very, very accessible she was and certainly, she works for you. So that is, she’s a wonderful resource and obviously, very open to to communication. Well, thank you very much for really appreciate your time. And thanks for working for us and helping to ensure that our our needs get met, you know, from a governmental level.

Beth Wanless 36:00
Thank you so much. And I just appreciate the opportunity to talk to everybody and I hope some folks reach out I would love to help anybody that needs needs a hand on anything.

D.J. Paris 36:11
All right, but Well, thank you very much, and thanks for being on the show. Thank you

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Kim Kerbis has been a top Chicago producer in real estate for 21 years. She has served on boards locally and at the national level. Her clients love her attention to detail and she teaches brokers how to get the same results at through her class “Kerb Appeal” at her firm, @Properties. Her clients love her, and you will, too!

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:14
Hello and welcome to episode three of keeping it real podcast the first podcast for real estate agents made by real estate agents. My name is DJ Paris, I am your host. And if you’re new to the show, what we do is go out and find really successful or impressive real estate agents and we interview them and we have them tell their story and also give tips so that everyone in the community can share and learn. Today is no exception. We have Kim Curtis on the show from App properties and she has a really impressive career. She has been in business for 21 years and is served Aside from her own personal production served on boards, including National Association of Realtors, she’s going to we just got finished talking she discusses how she got started, how she’s built her business, but also some of the as a teacher. She is an educator with people in her own firm talks about how to improve your skill set with your buyers and also talks about a lot of ethics issues that you can be aware of. So you can always do the right thing for your clients. So without further ado, let’s get started and Kim Curvas coming up.

Kim Curtis was born and raised in Chicago and began her real estate career in 1997 at the habitat company and quickly became a top producer there. Within two years she received a broker’s license in Illinois, and by 2001 She was also licensed in California and Colorado. Over the years she has received the following certifications. ABR which is accredited buyer’s representative CRS certified residential specialist GRI graduate of Real Estate Institute realtor Institute rather and the CNE my personal favorite, this certified negotiation expert. She was a member of cars ethics and grievance committee from 2005 to 2009. And she’s also served on cars Professional Standards Committee since 2010. In the last few years, Kim has been representing ad properties as a large firm rep at the national level where she serves on the board of directors for National Association of Realtors. Kim is also known for her working with buyers course curb appeal, which she teaches the new agents at at properties outside of real estate. Kim has been a vice president of the Francis Parker Alumni Association, where her primary goal is increasing scholarship funds for the school and was recently elected to the school’s board of trustees. Welcome to the show.

Kim Kerbis 2:45
Thanks for having me.

D.J. Paris 2:47
Great. Well, you have done a lot with your real estate career and intro I just read, although you didn’t get to hear some of it. It was pretty extensive. And so tell us a little bit more about how you got involved in real estate.

Kim Kerbis 3:02
Well, actually, I, I’ve been in the business now I think 21 years. And I do have a mother who was an architect and developer in Lincoln Park and in Chicago. So I did always I was always exposed to real estate and design and architecture. So that was kind of always there. But then well, about 21 plus years ago, I was laid off from my previous position right before I was about to get married. And so I kind of had a month off in the summer and my best friend and I were playing tennis at the DePaul tennis courts, Fullerton and Sheffield, which is now at Whole Foods. And we’re playing tennis. And there’s these two really good looking guys who are playing tennis next to us. And at the end of the hour, as we’re getting in our cars, we see them getting in there. They’re very nice cars. So my best friend said to them, you know, what is it that you guys do that you get to play tennis in the middle of the day and still drive away and such nice cars. And they both said, We’re real estate agents. And it turned out to be the Devereaux brothers who did a lot of business back then. And so my friend turned to me said, Oh my God, that’s what you should do. And so I literally I got married, and within a month I you know, started taking my classes and within you know, the year was in business, and I started at the habitat company, you know, six months after that.

D.J. Paris 4:22
Wow. And then how, how have things changed? Since you know over the last 21 years? How is your business evolved?

Kim Kerbis 4:30
Like think, you know, technology obviously is a big part of that because when I started fax machines were new technology. Pretty much nobody had a cell phone I remember stopping a car with client when I had clients where an agent wasn’t that the showing time at the location. And I stopped I had to stop my car and like, you know, at a payphone and make a phone call to see work where the agent was and So yeah, facts. And we were if you remember the MLS system, it wasn’t a computer, but it was a black screen with, you know, orange text. And it was like a das based system. So you type in area equals 807. And ber bedrooms equals two plus. And that was the MLS at that time. So I wasn’t I haven’t been around since it was a paper MLS, but it was still a pretty basic system. So, you know, that has affected everybody. But that, you know, the software that we have now and the technology that people have today is just extraordinary that I have seen in the 21 years that I’ve been in business.

D.J. Paris 5:39
Yeah, I would imagine it’s in some ways made things easier, and in other ways, probably not made things a lot easier. But certainly, it’s nice to at least be able to see photos.

Kim Kerbis 5:49
Right. And then And then even when the MLS kind of got better, there was just a single photo of the exterior of the building. And we would always tease the MLS because it was basically like a guy in a car, who took a snapshot never even got to other car, let alone that close up and half the time there’d be a tree in front of the property. And it’s it’s extraordinary, just how quickly it’s changed in 20 years.

D.J. Paris 6:12
Well, I’d like to ask about your designations, you have many and I’m a huge fan of doing education for realtors, tell us a little bit about you know why you pursued those and how they helped you in working with clients?

Kim Kerbis 6:27
Well, my basic thing is I just kind of always believe in education. So I mean, I have a master’s degree, which has nothing to do with real estate. And I just did it because I love it. And so I feel very comfortable in this in the school or classroom setting. So pretty much when I once I got the sale, and at that time was called the salespersons license. Within a year or two I was I got my broker’s license because I thought, Oh, well, one day, I’ll be a managing broker. And so there was an additional training required with that. And then I just sort of thought, oh, it’s really good to kind of sharpen your sword every couple of years. So at a certain point, you know, I think I got the GRI first, which was actually the most challenging. And then later got the NOAA or the CRS I got and then GRI and then the APR. And so I just always felt like it was important to be in addition to the continuing ed that’s required, that there’s additional training that you can do, and it it does make you think about things in a different way. And hopefully you’re learning something from each, you know, developing techniques or adding techniques to your own, you know, quill or your own toolbox. And then I also think it’s a great opportunity to meet other people. And so I think I did my CRS in different locations. And so and in fact, it’s all deductible, so you could like you could do your CRS in Hawaii, and you know, deduct the whole thing. And so you’re you’re meeting other people from different places. And so the idea also is that you’re possibly increasing your referral base as well, you know, from state to state. But it just it’s really just an inherent thing that I love education and so it also kind of makes sense about the teaching too because once you kind of develop a pattern or a per i call it you know, developing a protocol, you know, you want to I mean, if you’re I don’t know, I just sort of feel like I want to share that with other people to help them because I did not have any of the training and habitat company honestly.

D.J. Paris 8:24
Sure well and a different type of company for sure. And tell us in the let’s that’s a perfect segue into you becoming a teacher as with respect to new brokers or brokers new to at least at properties tell us a little bit about curb appeal your your own course.

Kim Kerbis 8:40
So initially started at that properties did maybe like a five or 10 week session of agents who are new to the company or new to real estate and I was asked to do the listing there was one class I’m listing and after a couple years I realized I was actually really good much better at the buyers are much better at teaching the buyer side because I had developed this technique and it seems so simple, but it really just comes down to having a meeting with clients before you set before they set foot in your car. And before you kind of spent any time out on the road with anybody setting up appointments or whatnot. I think it’s really important to get an idea and there’s obviously 100 questions that you can ask people but everything from you know how much counterspace to the current when somebody says you know I want to be kitchen. You we all assume that we know what they’re talking about. But you know if they’re struction is two feet has two feet of counter space. For them a big kid you know, doubling their counter space is only four feet, right? We’re but if you have four feet now, maybe 12 feet is big. So just kind of like really zeroing in or, you know, drilling down on what they have now and what they’re looking for, you know what their needs are what has changed in their life. And then I also kind of call it the getting to know you as in K and O W And then also that, like, trying to find what would prevent them from purchasing, like getting to the know, like, if there used to be that getting to yes, I’m trying to find what what are the obstructions that would prevent somebody from moving forward. So whether it’s a medical bankruptcy or divorce or you know, something bad on their credit, you want to find out all those things before, at least I do want to find out all those things before they get in my car, and I want to make sure they’re pre approved. And I want to make sure they’re realistic. And I want to make sure that they know the market and, and things that impinge on the market. And you really it’s all about learning, teaching them the process, and then also setting expectations about what’s realistic. So that’s a long answer. But I mean, it’s it’s a two hour interview that I have with clients before we go out to property. So that was a huge investment that I make. But I still think it’s better than making a single appointment. And then fine, because i It’s all you know, we all learn from our mistakes. And so I just everything that I teach in my class are things that I’ve learned from making mistakes with clients, like not finding out that there was a divorce or bankruptcy or, you know, whatever it is, or that they had a pool table that I didn’t ask about all those things I like to share in class. And my feeling is, if people can kind of take one thing away from the class, that then then they can they can incorporate it into their protocol, whatever their business is, then I feel like I’ve made a difference.

D.J. Paris 11:41
100% agree, and I just I love the idea, aside from it being incredibly useful to say, Hey, before we go see any property, I do this extensive conversation to make sure I fully understand your goals, your objectives, your needs, your timeline, and, and also very practical to because now you have all of the information to be able to serve, the better. But also, it separates you from literally 99% of the other, you know, other brokers out there who are also trying to win that business. And certainly, you know, if they even talked to three other brokers before you, no one else is doing that, or at least few brokers are and so that alone, at least, you know, and being able to explain it as, Hey, I can’t do my job without a really, you know, important conversation about what you guys need is probably, sadly, unique in this industry. So

Kim Kerbis 12:37
and I liken it to any other professional, you know, you go to a dentist, and they don’t just immediately put their hands in your mouth and start pulling teeth, you know, there’s a consultation process. And the more that we you know, again, whether it’s a doctor, lawyer, Indian chief, the more the that professional has a conversation about what the goals, you know, that that somebody is looking to achieve and what the strategy is to get there. I just sort of liken it to every you know, every time you walk into a doctor’s office, there’s like an intake sheet, right? And then

D.J. Paris 13:12
there’s 5050 questions on what are you allergic to? Are you learning this and so all of those are important because you can’t do your job without those answers either. So and then,

Kim Kerbis 13:23
probably not like before, I know, some people will just like do it in the 15 minutes before a showing. And I really like to control the environment, I want them relaxed, I want them focused, I don’t want their I don’t do it in a Starbucks because I don’t like the sound of coffee making going on, you know, I want that person to know that this is very important that I’m dedicating my time to them that they’re my entire focus for that period of time, I’m taking notes. And, and again, I just think of any other professional where there’s a consultation before anything happens. And the other part of it is that you want to set their expectations about you. And so for example, let’s say you don’t work on Sundays, or you don’t take phone calls after 7pm. That’s an opportunity for you to share what their expectations of you should be as well. And then finally, it’s really about creating a relationship. And so I think that you save a lot more time down the line, when you just kind of do it in this focus way and then later you can say, oh, yeah, I remember we had that conversation about the lead based paint disclosure or whatever it is. So it’s like it’s a basis for it’s a jumping off point for all sorts of things. So I’ve just, that was like the big difference that I made in my business. From my second year to my third year was just and that was before I had a forum for it or before I had a package for it but just like having a sheet of paper and a pen and sitting down with people in the conference room, which just was like a night and day you know, 180 degree difference in my business.

D.J. Paris 14:55
Probably also gets the deal closed more quickly. because you now know exactly what the person is looking for the couple’s looking for. Yeah yeah and it’s it’s it’s just very very smart way to go about working with buyers and sellers obviously you probably do the same thing on the on the reverse side yeah do you did have you did tell us about it unusual experience where with your with the two flat brokers do you mind sharing it just to change up the

Kim Kerbis 15:30
it’s like, again you we always learn from our mistakes or at least our experiences and this was a two flat over on was now right by the Mariana was at Lawrence and it was a really beaten up to flat and it was being sold. It was an estate sale it was being sold as is. And I was doing showing with these two women and their agent and and I’m telling you there’s literally nothing more saving like the house had been stripped. The one thing that was leftover was like an old fashioned farmhouse sink, which was awesome. But I don’t even know the plumbing wasn’t working, it was just a mess. And so anyway, we’re going down into the basement and, and I could not believe it because I walked I probably walked first which of course now I wouldn’t do but at the time we didn’t know about we weren’t thinking about security. But anyway, and buyers are behind me. And then the agent came down and he literally fell through the stairs, and they were just so rickety. It was awful. The good news is he didn’t fall far, because it was one of the steps were like the second or third step from the ground. So he just hit the step and just took a long step down. But it was really scary. And you know, the good news is nobody was hurt. And there were no lawsuits. But it was just that moment when you realize that kind of anything can happen. And then we all need to be.

D.J. Paris 16:51
Sure. And I want to talk a little bit about some of the boards that you serve on in particular, I know you do a lot with ethics, you also are on the National Association of Realtors, board of directors. Are there any, you know, over all the years? You’ve seen? Are there any particular avoidable sort of situations that you think brokers really should be aware of and be making sure they’re in compliance with?

Kim Kerbis 17:17
Yeah, so I was on ethics and grievance kind of during the downturn. And so what we saw a big influx of was procuring cause cases. And that there is no honestly there is no simple answer for that because I am honestly, if you have five people on a particular board hearing a particular case, maybe I shouldn’t say this, but I swear you could get and you have a different set of people hearing the same case, you may get an answer, I really wish that national association would come kind of come up with a lockstep way in which procuring cause can be dealt with. But that is a place where I think the there’s more procuring cause cases when the market is tight, and people are not making money, so they get more grabby. And then when the market is better, they’re more comfortable, and there’s like better flow. And so they kind of let things they’re more likely to let things go. Go by, I think the easiest or the one, one of the best things that people can do, obviously, is keep records, you know, keep emails, and the hard thing is when people text you, because it’s hard to kind of it’s well, it’s not hard, but it’s a little bit more, takes a couple more steps to archive that material. But keeping good files, keeping notes, you know, when you talk to this person, or saving those kind of significant emails, I think are ways that people can kind of protect themselves. And then actually, it’s been this year has been kind of quiet with pro standards there. I’ve only set on a couple cases. But there’s a ton of people on first standard. So there may be more after that I’m just not aware of. So I don’t have a simple answer to say how can people protect people? I think protect yourself. I think it’s more about, you know, keeping good records and keeping good files on on client and attorney and whatever interaction?

D.J. Paris 19:18
Sure, no, it makes perfect sense. And just to go back to your own personal production, because you have had a very, very successful career as a producer. Of course, we just talked about you as an educator and author of serving as a board member giving back to the community. But why do you think and I love this isn’t always easiest question to answer for someone to talk about themselves. But why do you think you’ve you’ve built a successful practice? Why do you think your clients are happy and refer business to you?

Kim Kerbis 19:46
I think I mean, I’m good at my job. Although of course it’s a profession, but I am really responsible and responsive. But mostly I think it’s because I’m real, I’m not fake. And I don’t try and pretend that I’m somebody that I’m not. And I think that’s actually easier for younger and truly meaning like younger agents, like people who are like in their, let’s say, 20s and 30s, who they’re within the zeitgeist, it’s a lot easier to be yourself than it was 20 years ago, when I started where, you know, there was sort of like a way in which real estate agents talked or dressed, or the cars that they drove, or their hairstyles, or their shoes, or whatever it was, that was sort of like that classic, you know, what it meant to be a female real estate agent, you know, you look like acts, and I think now, it’s, it’s more open to whoever you are, whatever type of person, I just think this, I just think society is, like, more open to it. But I think at the time, I was kind of be myself before it was cool to be yourself. And I, I, that authentic word is so overused these days, but I do sort of think that I never tried to, you know, bullshit people, I never, I just never tried to put on airs of any sort. And I just was what I was, and you either liked it, or you didn’t. And that was okay. And, but I’m still professional, and I still take it really seriously. But I just wasn’t fulfilling the kind of old fashion modes of women in real estate at the time. So I think that kind of just differentiated me and then with, when I develop this to our meeting, that also just kind of differentiated me in a different way.

D.J. Paris 21:38
Yeah, definitely. I think that’s a, that’s a really complete answer. And so I think you just have the standards for, obviously, for yourself, or, you know, the amount of work that you do for a client, but also for, you know, also separates you from from everyone else who may be, you know, competition, which I’m sure you don’t even view as competition.

Kim Kerbis 22:02
But, you know, I think we’re all competitive in some ways, or at least I’m very competitive, but what I try and do, and I’m not always good at this, because we can, you know, get down on ourselves, but I really try and see what other people are doing, and learn from them and see if it’s something that I can incorporate into my business too. So, you know, just the longer you’re around, and you see how other people interact, or how they present themselves, or how they do showings, I’ve, I just you learn a ton from other people. And then I think it’s all about sort of like being, you know, I don’t know, you just you take a concept that they’re doing, and you apply it to yourself, but you, you make it your own when you do it yourself. And so you’re, you’re getting inspired by them, but then you’re incorporating it and kind of you know, for me, I’m playing like the chem twist on it. But I think we can always continue to learn from other people. And I swear, I’m sure other every other agent will say this, which is we learn something new every day, we think we’ve got it, and then some you know, something will happen. And you realize, oh, I hadn’t thought of, you know, I hadn’t anticipated that particular thing. And so then you just learn from it. And you you know, try and be better the next time so that you can anticipate it.

D.J. Paris 23:13
I think that’s a perfect answer. Well, thank you so much for your time, if anyone can how can clients reach you if they have needs of buying selling renting? What’s the best way for them to reach you?

Kim Kerbis 23:24
Yeah, so my office number is 773-305-0585. And my email is Kim Curtis at at property stack calm. And they also do have a website, which is like effects chicago.com And so there’s like a nice introduction and photo of me and that kind of stuff.

D.J. Paris 23:41
Awesome. Well, Kim has been in business for 21 years and she’s obviously done been incredibly successful not just in the personal production but as an as an educator as well as serving on boards and we’re really appreciate she’s busy. Well, we appreciate and thank you so much.

Kim Kerbis 23:59
Thank you so much for having me. Have a great day.

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Today we sit down with Mitir Patel, a Chicago real estate broker who specializes in investments, specifically converting multi-family to single-family homes. He discusses his exact strategies for finding properties, finding investors, and what he sees for the future of Chicago real estate investments.

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:14
Hello, and welcome to keeping it real pod, the only podcast for real estate brokers made by real estate brokers. My name is DJ Parris. I’m your host through the show, and thank you for tuning in. This is our second episode. And in case you missed the first I want to quickly explain what this podcast is all about. So I work at a real estate firm here in Chicago, we have hundreds of brokers, many brokers who join us are brand new. And so one of the biggest questions our support and training team receive when in particular new brokers come on board is, hey, what are the veteran brokers doing? What are the most successful agents at your firm doing? So over the years, we’ve interviewed them? And we’ve obviously asked them what they’re doing to become successful, what’s worked for them what advice they have for newcomers, etc? And then sort of occurred to us well, why are we living in it to just our own brokers, there’s 40,000, brokers in Chicago, and obviously, hundreds of 1000s of more across the country. So we decided to open this up to everyone. So the idea here is that every week, we’re going to be bringing you an interview with a real estate broker who’s doing something we think particularly interesting, and maybe could help everyone else. Learn more about how to become more successful in their own real estate practice. So that’s it. And if you’d like to be featured as a guest, or or you have an idea of somebody that you think would be a good interview, you can visit our website at keeping it real pod.com. And you can send us a message there. Also, if you wanted to sponsor one of the episodes, you can do that there as well. Today on the show, we have Mattia Patel, who is a real estate broker here in Chicago, and he a little bit about him, he has a background in finance. But he himself has been a real estate investment investor for 15 years. In fact, his parents were doing it even before that. So what he specializes in his helping people transition to real estate investments. He’s been doing that for over five years. He specializes specifically in multi unit added value plays. So for example, converting multifamily into single family and very specific neighborhoods. We talked a lot about how he got investor started investments, how he finds investors, how he finds properties, how he puts deals together, and why he chooses to do that more so than traditional realtor stuff. And it’s really interesting, I think you’re going to love it. And we really appreciate material being on the show. So let’s get started.

So we’re here today with tear Patel Mateer. We thought it would be particularly interesting and fun to talk to you for the show because of his particular niche that is more unusual or rare for brokers that I’ve met. So thanks, Mateer for being on the podcast.

Mitir Patel 3:10
Thanks for having me here. DJ. Yeah, thanks.

D.J. Paris 3:12
And so tell us a little bit about how did you how’d you get started in real estate.

Mitir Patel 3:16
So my father was a passive real estate investor some 30 years ago, and I watched as his business grew, and it became supplemental income to the point where it surpassed his income as a scientist. So he was a buy and hold buying rolls out in early 80s, Reagan had a way for you to take your depreciation and mitigate your taxes. And obviously, after the SNL crisis or anything, they removed that deduction, and it no longer holds to that being said, he invested in real estate and he found that, you know, it was passive way to generate significant income and over the life of the loan, you know, you have something real,

D.J. Paris 3:51
and it became his primary source of income. Really? Wow. Did he end up doing that full time? Or did he still continue as a chemist or

Mitir Patel 3:58
he retired at 50. And then now he places his grandkids and collects rent every month.

D.J. Paris 4:05
Yeah, that’s amazing. was here in Chicago?

Mitir Patel 4:09
The north side in the northwest suburbs?

D.J. Paris 4:12
Is that where you grew up as well? I

Mitir Patel 4:13
did. I grew up in Roselle and his buildings were mostly in the northwest suburbs, and he still has the majority of them or he sold the vast majority out in 2007. Then in 2009, he bought some

D.J. Paris 4:23
Gotcha. So you grew up watching basically your dad be a landlord?

Mitir Patel 4:27
Yeah, I do it much differently than him. But yeah, I did. Yeah. And, and so

D.J. Paris 4:31
what, what year did you get your broker license?

Mitir Patel 4:35
So I got my broker license in 2009. After the financial crisis. I was planning on getting buying more real estate and at that point, I started pulling money from other traders that I knew and starting to find

D.J. Paris 4:52
interesting, so tell me about that. How did you go about putting that fun together?

Mitir Patel 4:56
It actually happened. I snapped a Segway somewhere else but I, after college, I became a trader at one of those exchanges that may no longer exist in a few years. And for 14 years out of college, I was a options trading. So

D.J. Paris 5:09
you wear the jacket and wear the jacket, are you done by two o’clock and right

Mitir Patel 5:12
and I took every bonus, I had bought apartment buildings smart. And then throughout the years, a lot of friends are like asking me how I was generating this additional income when the market was moving against us. And I explained it to them. And around the financial crisis in all this opportunity opportunity presented itself, a bunch of friends came to me and said, Why don’t you pull funds together, and we’re starting to fund and invest in real estate. You know,

D.J. Paris 5:37
it’s so interesting, you mentioned, that seems like so many brokers who work with investors, at some point get in touch with traders who just seem to be cash heavy, they’re risk averse, because their old career is is pretty risk risk heavy, and they and they love sort of guaranteed or somewhat guaranteed rate of return or reliable rate of return. And real estate oftentimes can provide that.

Mitir Patel 6:00
It is for most traders, this is the lowest form of risk offered. And long term. You know, as long as you secure your financing, and you invest in the right areas, it’s very low risk, very high return. And

D.J. Paris 6:14
so you put a fun together you had co colleagues or friends that were traders that were able to help fund it. And then your role is to go out and find properties. And that’s kind of

Mitir Patel 6:24
together. So either properties, renovate them, rent them and manage them. And I for that I took a 20% stake in the company. Super, very smart. Right? We started out in 2008 in Logan Square in Avondale. And obviously now it’s a different neighborhood than was back then. Buildings were trading for at 250,000. Now, similar buildings are 350. Wow, these are all we only buy projects. Sure. So from that, you know, we, through you know it trial and error, we learned to perfect kind of a system in how you purchase properties and how to maximize your return. And I’ve created a great team for that, too.

D.J. Paris 7:01
So to talk a little bit about the team and sort of how you guys do it today.

Mitir Patel 7:05
Yeah, so I still I represent clients and this fund. So majority of my brokerage business is finding properties for investors, whether it be large or small first time buyers. And I have a great attorney I work with that could do lists, which also represented the banks. So it was a good relationship. Beyond that we work with Tyler Mandic and Shane banks, banks with a zoning code for city of Chicago. So when we look at a property, he gives us assessment, and generally we add value by changing zoning on all these properties.

D.J. Paris 7:37
Oh, that’s interesting. Yeah. And nobody knows more than him, I guess.

Mitir Patel 7:40
Yeah. And then so you know, every week we’re sitting down with aldermen getting their support, it could be something as simple as person has to fight within the legal garden, when they go to sell it, the garden can have no value, it cannot be appraised for that will go to the aldermen and work out a deal where we can make that legal for a few $1,000 or some concession you give to the community. And then you added 80 to 100,000 hours of value to your property. That’s amazing. That’s often the easiest one.

D.J. Paris 8:08
How did you how did you learn how to how to do that? You

Mitir Patel 8:11
know, I started doing a lot of a lot of this business. And then Candela’s, the father senior kind of introduced me to shakes and they said, You guys could work well together and do some bigger things.

D.J. Paris 8:24
Wow. How did you find the properties? today? I know we’re jumping a bit. But how do you locate properties?

Mitir Patel 8:30
So it’s half I get half I get phone calls or texts from random people. They’ll literally see my name on the construction permit. And they’ll call it the other half is misrepresented listings on MLS.

D.J. Paris 8:44
When can you give me an example of what what is the misrepresented list?

Mitir Patel 8:47
So I just put a contract together for a property at I guess I can do the address right. 3555, North Milwaukee, and it was listed as a like a commercial use commercial building. But really, it’s a two flat with the commercial space. And it’s also next to the Ottoman that I do a lot of work with, and we’re gonna get it rezone to illegal three fat very easily. Wow. And it was 20,000 hours.

D.J. Paris 9:12
Wow. Yeah. So it’s so it’s so that that’s an MLS listing that you noticed was was categorized wrong, or incorrectly or had an opportunity to be recaptured. And then when things aren’t on the MLS, you typically mentioned to get phone calls occasionally. Are you sourcing properties other ways as well, or

Mitir Patel 9:31
so I have, I’ve worked with a bunch of builders who also send out flyers. I don’t particularly care to do that. But if something, something comes up, that’s interesting. I’ll pursue it. But truthfully, that’s probably like 5% of what we get. A lot of it’s you do a deal here, and then someone approaches you. Sure. I was building my own home on Roscoe Roscoe village, and this elderly gentleman came up to me said I want so my home. So that’s how we got our next project. David and Rosco.

D.J. Paris 10:01
Wow. Yeah, it’s interesting. So you, you you were telling me before before we started recording about conversion properties? Yes. And that I thought was particularly interesting. Can you talk a little bit about Sure. So

Mitir Patel 10:15
it’s a crazy thing when you when you buy it, I certainly talked about Roscoe Bucha. North center, because they have the marquee schools and everyone wants to be in. When you look at the homes there, they’re trading at about 350 to 450 a square foot new construction, but for some reason, the apartment buildings are trading at 200 to 300 square foot, okay. So in a lot of them are breaking new construction, they have really good bones. So there’s a huge advantage. Whereas if you come in right now you’re gonna buy a home, you’re gonna pay at least 1.4 in Roscoe, which for a new home, I can find you to flat for $600,000. And if we work well, with our budget for around three to 400,000, we can renovate it, and you have a 4000 square foot home.

D.J. Paris 10:55
That’s amazing. What’s the type of turnaround time on something like that?

Mitir Patel 10:59
Truthfully, it’s a year yeah. Anyone who does it quicker doesn’t have a husband, wife or family involved. But every process becomes a decision and right. But he was a flipper probably six months.

D.J. Paris 11:11
Wow. And so you’re in you found that they’re just brokers aren’t as knowledgeable about these types of projects.

Mitir Patel 11:19
Now. I mean, right now, we I infected a client to see a property and Bell and Ross was under contract. And I saw the other agent with his client. And I talked to the listing agent in San Diego, we’re gonna present an offer because I know this deals not gonna go through. Sure enough, the deal that broke and she called me yesterday, it’s, I heard what the agent was saying costs were they’re not realistic about what things cost, you know, like foundations excavation, and if you if you haven’t had any involvement or any experience, why would you go right and unfortunately then you know, a lot of realtors become either home and maybe a client ends up in a situation they shouldn’t be and I’ve seen that two or 3k loans a lot of people way you know, Scope of Work nowhere near what really needs to be done especially in like Logan Square Pilsen most of those buildings have termite damage and the foundations are worthless. Wow. So they see the low price and they think they can just clean it up and there’s so much more involved.

D.J. Paris 12:13
Wow. And so you know, on the investor side Oh, as far as finding investors to work with you know, obviously with your history as a trader you have access to those those you know, people who are in that industry, but if you if you were maybe not in that industry as a previous career, how would you go about finding people to help fund those projects

Mitir Patel 12:35
so I I’ve worked with a mortgage lender having like a seminar in a bar as far as getting clients but truthfully, it was you know, talking to people at events I got a hedge fund that manages money from McKinsey and I’m now represented them in this particular business. So it’s a you have to get out there it’s unfortunately my grant the whole social aspect of it but that’s kind of these people are at these events and you know, when they hear there’s another way for them make money and that’s so much less risky than the market your market is very high right now. They want to diversify it.

D.J. Paris 13:07
Sure. Sure. And you know, our kale royalties owner Nick Patterson, have you obviously you know, has always said fighting money is actually not that difficult isn’t the deals is the challenge and if you can get the deal together the money just kind of finds you

Mitir Patel 13:21
Nick is 100% right on that Yeah.

D.J. Paris 13:23
So where do you see the Chicago market headed for for your particular niche, you know, in some of the developed the projects that you guys work on, do you see anything changing in the next few years so

Mitir Patel 13:35
we’ll take in that spare opportunity for ways i as far as the high end home market I see that hit we’re at capacity and inventories high so I would probably stay away from something like that. As far as with cayenne candles, things like that. apartment buildings, it’s crazy because the prices are much higher. But we look at Cap rates which is the net return on the property they’ve actually gotten better because the rents have gone up so much interesting. So if you can find a building and Logan Square if you can find that building. There’s a way we can renovate it and make money

D.J. Paris 14:09
yeah, there I’ve always heard as far as finding some of those properties you know, getting creative with it. There’s brokers that have basically you know when when one of those buildings puts a an apartment for rent phone number, which may be the owner you know, Mom and Dad Mom and Pop owning the building or something, you know, maybe it’s a management company too, but just going Hey, Are you the owner, which is Sal, if I offered you X, Y and Z, there’s a lot of creative ways to get in front of those people who aren’t necessarily thinking necessarily you know, they haven’t put on the MLS, it’s not for sale, but maybe they would have somebody approached them. But you know, then that takes a little bit, a little bit of work to do those things. But yeah, so as far as the so that was on the buy and hold side. What What challenges have you guys run into with being you’re also a property manager? Right. All right. So I do, do you find that does that eat up a lot of your time or property

Mitir Patel 15:04
management, I’ve got a good team with me. So they handle most of that. As far as rentals go, we have great agents and rent the apartments, I don’t do any of that it’s very time consuming. Honestly, our biggest problem is construction timelines, permits sure in the billing department. The city obviously is inundated with new permits and construction, we it’s always, you know, boom or bust here, right? Sure. So we have a dangerous amount of apartments coming online downtown. Whereas in, I always cite North Center building square, because those are very active areas, what you’re seeing is a lot, especially in these two neighborhoods, seeing a lot of places being sold, that were two flats and three flats and being turned into single family homes. So with the exception of some of the Centrum properties that are near the Tod projects, there’s a real deficiency in housing. That’s happening,

D.J. Paris 15:52
that’s interesting. So it’s a real need for

Mitir Patel 15:54
right and they thought the Tod zoning, I don’t know if your listeners are familiar with the transit oriented development, allowing them to build these large buildings near our stations where you wouldn’t need parking would pick up the slack. It’s helping in Logan Square and cap on California in Milwaukee, they built those two towers. But that’s again, a different price point in these neighborhoods, kind of on the Brown Line, that you’re not really seeing that much of that, except for old town. And then the one at Roscoe and Lincoln.

D.J. Paris 16:20
Gotcha. And you really pretty much hyperfocus in just a few neighborhoods,

Mitir Patel 16:25
I do. I’m there, you know, I like everyone else I was I was I was pulled to the high returns of certain areas that really weren’t there. And I learned a life lesson very early on. So which is which Paper Paper numbers aren’t realistic, you have to look at the neighborhood vacancy rates and other factors before he, you know, can assess if it’s a profitable investment or not.

D.J. Paris 16:51
Yeah, that’s a good point. And in fact that that brings it to another question about, you know, if as a broker who’s maybe servicing the more traditional homebuyer trend, you know, who wants to get more acclimated to investment, sort of valuation or just sort of how to go about learning? What What would you recommend, are there resources that you you feel would be helpful to someone who’s new.

Mitir Patel 17:17
So a great way to figure out what a building could be worth is a website, rental meter.com, and it’s free. And it’ll give you the immediate rent scenario based on the size of the unit.

D.J. Paris 17:30
Oh, so you can figure out the cap rate pretty well to lease because a lot of these old

Mitir Patel 17:33
buildings are like my dad’s even guilty of this, too. He’s had tenants for 15 years, maybe he hasn’t raised rent to market. So you can see that maybe this should be a $600 apartment should be a 1400 apartment. And you can kind of assess what the value could be if you got in there. Put a fresh coat of paint on a new kitchen bathroom. Sure.

D.J. Paris 17:49
So you can see you would go to that site, you see that rents are lower than they ought to be. And then what do you do from there? Then you approach the owner? And

Mitir Patel 17:58
yeah, you make an offer, sir. And obviously, there’s a lot of things you until you open up a wall you don’t know. And I had a client is actually the first sale ever made. It was a very large building in Avondale. And he opened the walls up, they literally disintegrated. So there was no sign of termite inspection and even a termite inspection. But, you know, so simple project ended up becoming this huge ordeal. So he actually looked at it as an opportunity to make it a much bigger building. Sure. And in the end, it worked out. But I mean, it’s a scary thing, right? Sure, sure. So you don’t I mean, you don’t ever really know unless, you know, you open up the walls. That being said, if I ever look at a building, I go to the basement first, the basement can tell the whole story about a building. If it’s clean, you don’t see signs of water or crack in the foundation. That’s a good sign.

D.J. Paris 18:47
Yeah, for the walls haven’t been painted over to hide the mold. Or I have a friend that happened to bought a very expensive home. And the previous owners have literally painted the basement walls to tie the mold. And I imagine you’re active or at least have been active on bigger pockets as a.com I don’t know if that’s yeah, I was just gonna references as a resource for its if you’re not familiar. Yeah, it’s a large I think it’s the largest online forum for investors who wanted to chat back and forth a real estate investors of course, and it’s, it’s like maybe 100 bucks a year, it’s totally worth it. And it’s it’s just a great place to get information you you wouldn’t need to go there for learning

Mitir Patel 19:30
about investigating, but it’s always nice, bounce your ideas off someone else. It’s

D.J. Paris 19:33
interesting. And they do have actively, you know, people trade properties on there. So it’s really it’s Yeah, you should check it out bigger pockets. It’s, it’s, it’s very cool. I’ve actually tried to reach out to them to do because they do their own podcast as well, which is great. But I’ve tried to reach out to them to do for this and I haven’t been able to discuss successfully region but they are awesome. They have 10s of 1000s of investors who are just chatting, it’s just a big forum. It’s basically like a gigantic online forum. And thank you but really well moderated. So it’s not like a broker necessarily couldn’t go out there and say, hey, if anyone needs a realtor, give me a call. But it’s particularly but anyway. Any other resources you’ve been using recently to figure out you know, investment opportunities. Training like Are you a co star Luke net guy or so?

Mitir Patel 20:18
I’ve used Luke in the past. I haven’t really currently, a lot of stuff I see I lunette is kind of priced high people put it out there, because it’s, it’s kind of a passive aggressive way of marketing your practice. Sure. And people if someone bites share, that being said, seems like especially as bigger buildings, they seem to be pocket listings. Yeah. And you kind of have to know the guys that are dealing in the areas.

D.J. Paris 20:41
Gotcha. So So what would you say? Do you have any? Are you have you pivoted your business at all? You know, in the last year, has anything changed? Or just so we’re,

Mitir Patel 20:49
obviously as prices? As neighborhoods mature, we have to move on. So

D.J. Paris 20:56
yeah, you’re thinking about other neighborhoods or wait,

Mitir Patel 20:58
so we follow Milwaukee Avenue. And obviously, Logan squares kind of mature. Avondale has matured. So now we’re at Portage Park? Gotcha. You know, old urban. And it’s a great community. And it’s, it’s growing. And also we are west and north, which I thought I would never do. But, you know, up to 3000 West. Sure. That being said, there’s, there’s nothing wrong with going further from these borders. It’s just depends on what you’re looking for.

D.J. Paris 21:26
And this is just a selfish question, because I used to live there. I had a condo in Uptown for the 11 years. And that’s a particularly interesting neighborhood. You probably have I don’t know how much you’ve ever looked into it. But I know it’s been around. Where were you grew up in?

Mitir Patel 21:38
So our lawyer? Yeah, there’s only lawyers doing a 200 unit building in uptown. Okay. And I’ve had issue we’re doing some developments in the west loop. And ultimately, Alderman Burnett is a great guy. We have to get the blessing of all the community groups in these neighborhoods where you can do a project. Sure in there, there’s like two or three. In uptown, there’s 42. Right? So my experience from people who I know who invested there, Scott’s very challenging to make everyone happy. Yes. And these aldermen are winning these elections by like one or two votes, so they will not cross anyone.

D.J. Paris 22:16
Yeah. So how do you deal with with aldermen when you’re having to navigate those political waters?

Mitir Patel 22:21
So we’re lucky in that lifetimes? They want us to use their contractors and they’re feeling as if they’re a better bid? I’ll use anyone. Sure. But generally, we’re trying to we’re trying to add units to the community trying to add value, right. So usually adding a unit overall, is going to help reduce the cost of living so they kind of support that thing. When I’m pretty shocked at the resistance in uptown. I can I can see that. Part of the problem is the new rents are probably double what the rents were. But they are also quadrupling the

D.J. Paris 22:50
amount of units there. Yeah. It’s finally maybe finally starting to mature. Yeah,

Mitir Patel 22:54
that is, as I say, personally, that’s one neighborhood I avoid. Yeah, just it’s tricky. It’s Yes. Yeah. And if it’s for the big boys, because it takes a lot of money to pay his lawyers to, you know, fight these battles for you. Well, I

D.J. Paris 23:07
very much appreciate your time. I think this has been extremely helpful. And probably one of the most unique interviews I will I will have done on this podcast. So I really appreciate it. And if anyone’s interested in learning in contacting you maybe have an opportunity for you. How would they get in touch with

Mitir Patel 23:24
a sure just email me that MIT IR pa to@gmail.com. And I’ll try to respond as quick as I can.

Alright, well, thanks material, really appreciate it. Thank you, DJ. Thanks. Enjoy the weekend.

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For our premiere episode we’re featuring Joan Edelberg, a 25 year real estate veteran broker. She discusses how she got started, how she’s continued to build her business over the years, and even how she closed one of Chicago’s 20 largest residential transactions last year!

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Transcript

D.J. Paris 0:09
Hi, and welcome to keeping it real pod, the first podcast made by real estate agents for real estate agents. My name is DJ Paris, and I am going to be your host through the show. So what is this podcast all about? Well, I work at a real estate firm here in Chicago that has over 500 brokers and one of the most requested questions that we receive on the support and training team is our brokers in particular, newer brokers really want to learn from experienced veteran agents in the business about what’s been working for them, what challenges they faced, maybe what advice they would have, in particular, someone isn’t new broker, and also what’s just been really successful over their entire career. So what we started doing is interviewing some of our more veteran agents, asking them to share their success stories, and also how they have built their business and continue to do so. And then we realized, well, there’s really 40,000 realtors in the Chicagoland area. And why keep this just internally. So what I decided to do was open up this process to every broker in the industry as a way to give back for industry that’s been very generous to us. And we thought it’d be also a lot of fun. So what we’re doing is interviewing realtors, who are having success in some capacity and letting them tell their story and so that other brokers can participate and share and maybe learn and even maybe implement some of those strategies. It’s really that simple. So if you yourself are a broker and want to be interviewed or you want to nominate somebody, you can visit our website, which is keeping it real pod.com and fill out a form and let us know who we should be talking to. Also, if you have any brokers in your office that you think could benefit from this podcast, send them the link and we’ll make it real easy to find. We’re also going to be creating these episodes on YouTube as well. So if you’re not a podcast person, you can still watch the or listen to the audio via YouTube. Today on the show we are interviewing Joan Adelberg, also known as Joni a little bit about Joanie, she was broker has been a broker rather since 1993. She was Rookie of the Year in 1994. She has also been a president platinum club Prudential preferred properties agent, as well as Best Newcomer at at properties. A little bit about her history. She grew up in Northbrook, after school, studied at the Art Institute of Chicago moved to Boston and owned and ran a handcrafted jewelry store on Newbury Street and moved to Los Angeles and played tennis while raising her daughter. She’s a proud single mother to Johanna and grandmother to Amari and Savannah lives. Lived in southeast Evanston for 25 years in downtown Chicago the last 10. She also and aside from being a realtor also rehabs she’s an investor rehab starter homes on the south side of Chicago. She represents buyers and sellers, as well as doing land grant deals for future development. She’s also a guest star on the TV show currently airing called Bringing a baller. So those are some highlights of her her tagline is there’s no place like Joan. So really excited. And let’s talk to Joe. Well, I’m really excited to have Joan Adelberg on the very first episode of Keeping it real. She also goes by Joni, Chicago, Joni and the show, whatever. So we’re really excited. And you know, again, the idea here is to highlight brokers, realtors that are really what I believe to be exceptional in the field and find out what they’re doing and how they continue to build their business and also how they got started. So thank you, Joanie, for being on the show. Really appreciate your time. I know you’re busy share. So really, we would first want to know, how did you get started in real estate?

Joan Edelberg 3:55
For a number of years, I was in healthcare, and I was managing outpatient ambulatory care facilities, which is surgery centers, and on a national basis. And I woke up one day and my hotel room and I called my assistant, Amelia and I said, Amelia, where am I and what am I supposed to be doing today? I don’t know if I was having a breakdown or what are you from all the travel and being a single mother and everything. It was just a lot. And that day I decided I really needed to make a change. So I resigned my position. And I sat around my house for about a week figuring out what I wanted to be when I grew up. And I realized that every Sunday back when there were still newspapers, I would pull out the real estate section. I come from a real estate family. I’m actually the third generation of Realtors, my daughters the fourth generation of brokers in the Family. And I realized that real estate was really a passion. It was something that I just loved to look at in the paper every Sunday. And I thought, well, I can make a career out of this. And that’s

D.J. Paris 5:13
pretty much how I got started. And that was 20, almost 25 years ago,

Joan Edelberg 5:17
that was almost 25 years ago, I sent my daughter away to camp and I did the accelerated program through the Chicago Association of Realtors, I don’t remember if it’s five days, 10 days, whatever it was, I sat on my chaise lounge, eight o’clock in the morning, I’d have breakfast at 738 o’clock, I was on my chaise lounge and study till noon, I’d have a half hour for lunch, I’d get back on my chairs, lounge study till five, quick dinner and then run to my evening class. I don’t remember if it was a week, or 10 days, or whatever it was, and I just crammed it all in my head. And I did it all based on when the test but then you had to have a day for the test, you couldn’t just go any day of the week for the state test. And I backed it all up, went took the exam. And that was the end of it. I was a broker.

D.J. Paris 6:03
So and you know, as well as I do so many people enter this industry and then leave the industry for because most likely they’re not going they’re not earning the income they want or generating the business they want. But you’ve been doing it for over two decades, two and a half decades. Why do you think you succeeded? What do you what would you attribute that to?

Joan Edelberg 6:23
Well, real estate is an interesting thing. There’s so many components to it that, you know, it’s not just residential. So I’ve been successful in actually making deals happen, as opposed to, you know, being a real estate broker in the residential field, which, you know, you market you do postcards, you work your sphere of influence. I’ve actually knocked on doors, lots of doors, and not just for residential right now, I’m working on a big commercial piece that I literally knocked on the door, and I said, Hi, would you like to sell this piece of real estate? And they said, No, I really hadn’t thought about it. But yeah, I actually would like to sell the real estate and then I got on the other phone and started calling people that it would be appropriate for. And hopefully that deal will come together next week. So you know, knocking on doors

D.J. Paris 7:18
helps. And again, the idea of knocking on a commercial a door for commercial purposes is I’ve never heard anyone I’m sure people do it. It’s certainly uncommon, or at least from what I what I know. And really, that’s that’s tremendously, tremendously smart idea. So you just walk in and go straight for the owner. And

Joan Edelberg 7:38
that’s it. Hi, I’m here to sue the owner. Oh, where are you? Sam? Joan Adelberg. What do you here for? Well, I’d like to discuss that with the owner if they have just two minutes. And you know, as long as you’ve got on a suit, and you look like you’re there for a purpose, oftentimes you get into see the owner,

D.J. Paris 7:57
when I think he told me for this, this deal that I’m assuming it’s the same one that’s closing, hopefully closing soon as you walked into what maybe five places, and that was, that was his? It’s not like you walked into 100 places to get one it was five, right,

Joan Edelberg 8:09
right. I yeah, I walked into maybe five or six places. And, you know, for I would say the five or six places I walked into there were two that were sellers. And the other three, you know, had gold, of course, you know, and we’re about four times what the market would bear at this time. So they weren’t sellers. But that’s okay, I got to meet, you know, six new people. And it’s always good to meet new people.

D.J. Paris 8:38
And I know you also have really worked. You’re from the North Shore. And you tend to at least for the residential side, that tends to be a focus of yours as well. The higher end homes, the more luxury properties up there. How do you find those properties? And what do you do that’s maybe different, as far as how to market and sell them or convince the sellers to list with you, then maybe what other brokers are

Joan Edelberg 9:04
trying? Well, again, I have I have relationships that I’ve built over the years, there’s a developer, a very prolific developer up on the North Shore, and from time to time, if he’s out of product, or if he has a buyer that is looking for something special, he’ll call me and say, Do you have anything and I’ll say, No, I don’t have anything. Or maybe I do have something and I will go knock on doors. I made some of my largest deals, literally knocking on doors. So one time I literally drove around the North Shore, the developer called me and said, hey, you know, if somebody’s looking to do a tear down and build, you know, their dream home, and in Glencoe, specifically, and I literally drove around Glencoe and I looked at all of the homes that were on the lake and I determined which ones could possibly be tear downs and I hand wrote all 12 op notes and of the handwritten 12 notes that I delivered to the front doors of all of these places for people called me. And of the four, I was able to make one deal. So it was, you know, it was an interesting thing. And I, again met very interesting people on the lakefront and Glencoe and I was able to put a young family in a home from somebody who had lived there, that was their only home for the last 40 years. And it was a terrific, there was a terrific exchange, and everybody got to move on to where they wanted to be.

D.J. Paris 10:38
And I found that interesting with that particular transaction, if I remember correctly, if it’s the one I’m thinking of which by the way ended up is that the one that ended up being one of the largest transactions, residentially that year? Or is that was that a different? Yes,

Joan Edelberg 10:49
that was actually one of the top 20 residential sales for that particular year, home sale prices in six counties. So don’t be afraid to knock on doors.

D.J. Paris 11:01
Well, and also what I thought was so interesting, when you were doing that transaction was that, you know, for a transaction of that size, it was sizable. It’s not enough to just put it on the MLS and hope and that’s somebody wealthy enough to be able to afford it comes along, you have to go as the listing agent and almost source the buyer as well.

Joan Edelberg 11:19
Well, it was it was it was interesting in that, actually, that particular transaction took almost five years to come to fruition. I had sold it three times prior, and the family decided it’s a very close knit family that they didn’t want to sell, the wife wasn’t ready to move, the husband wanted to move and the wife was not ready. And I called up and I asked actually, who was wicking his bluff, and he said, It’s funny that you call I was going to call you were ready to sell. And I said, Oh, no, you know, unless your wife calls me and tells me she’s ready to sell. I just I can’t, just can’t. And he said, No, no, I swear we’re ready to sell. And he called his wife and she said, Yes, we’re ready to sell. I said, really? Are you ready to sell? She said, Yes. So that was how that transaction happened. But the

D.J. Paris 12:10
finding buyers was you sell?

Joan Edelberg 12:13
Oh, I was we were, according to every broker on the North Shore, we were about a million and a half dollars overpriced. And I said, Well, that’s great. But I believe that you are undervaluing these things. Oftentimes, you know, brokers work just a small area, and they become very provincial, they don’t look at the big picture. And, you know, in real estate, it’s really important to look at the entire picture and not just, you know, Glencoe properties. So I, you know, I approached it from a different vantage point in that, you know, here was a sizable piece of table land, a stable bluff, because it had been checked and taken care of over the 40 years that they owned it. And I looked at it and I thought, you know, this is really a treasure, you have a big piece of table land, it’s on one of the largest fresh bodies of water in the world. And I believed it to be worth a lot of money. So I had a lot a lot of buyers come in with ridiculous offers. I literally walked one man out the front door, he was sitting, we were sitting in the living room, on their chairs, looking, you know, out at the lake in their pool. And, you know, it’s a really lovely view. And his, his broker and his wife were walking around the house. And he, you know, gave me this ridiculous offer. And I said, Oh, thank you so very much for the offer. And I gently walked over to him and kind of picked him up out of the chair by the elbow and walked him to the front door. And I said, Thank you so much for coming. But if that’s your budget, I really think you should look at things in your budget. But this house will not treat for that pro Price. Thank you so much for wasting my time. And I walked him out the door, close the door behind him and said to his broker, you’re showing us over? Yeah, so you know, I mean, people, they like to waste our time sometimes. And sometimes, you know, the best approach is just kind of tell them you’re wasting your time.

D.J. Paris 14:14
What would you say is the most rewarding part of what you do?

Joan Edelberg 14:18
I like meeting new people, you know, making transactions that makes sense for both parties. Right now I’m working on a trade. I’ve never in my 25 years done an exchange. This is a property for property exchange. Two pieces of commercial property up north that you know, a company has wanted to acquire my seller as an individual and we’re working on a trade right now. It’s kind of an interesting transaction. I think my buyers gonna have to pay some money. My buyer, they’re both buyers, but one of the buyers is going to have to pay a little money because of the up hits, he’s got a backlog, they’ve got frontage. So, but I think it’ll all work out in the end.

D.J. Paris 15:06
And what advice do you have for maybe someone newer to the business to for longevity? How do you stick around?

Joan Edelberg 15:13
Keep it interesting. You know, it’s real estate, you get to do lots of things in the whole state of Illinois unless you have a license somewhere else. So I would say, just keep it interesting. Don’t just do this unless you’re a routine person. And like the routine, I don’t like the routine so much. I like to keep it new and interesting. But you know, if you’re a routine person, keep to the routine, if you’re not in routine person, keep it interesting.

D.J. Paris 15:40
Yeah, I like to that you and I don’t know that you classify yourself this way militarily to your clients, although you probably do is I like the idea that you are a dealmaker, that you aren’t just a listing agent, that you aren’t just, you know, you’re somebody that can come in and solve problems.

Joan Edelberg 15:54
Right? And that, you know, that’s a challenge in this business, because you have to be able to get your idea through the other broker to the other side. And that sometimes is a challenge. I know, early in my career, I was, you know, I was a baby broker. And I was dealing with one of the Gron. Dom’s from the North Shore. And I had a wine importer who had a condo, like a duplex condo over, you know, off of Irving Park Road. And I sold in the middle of a snowstorm to my own buyers, actually. And they called me for three years, how did you get so much money for this place? I guess I got lucky. And anyway, these people wanted to buy something, they started out at 200,000. Then they were 345. And then they told me they were at 750. I pulled down my sunglasses. And I looked at the couple and I said come on, you started out at $200,000. Now we’re three quarters of a million. And you know, we’re going back to the early 90s. I said, Come on, do really well. We could have done that all along. We just wanted to see what it would be I go Alright, fine. I was previewing, because they had two young children. And so I was previewing properties. And I walked into a property and the wife happened to have been a furniture designer in Italy for a number of years. And so she showed me pictures when we first got together of these most unbelievable properties with you know, rustic floors, and high ceilings and great moldings, and on and on. And I thought $200,000 beer budget, champagne tastes, not unusual for buyers. And so anyway, we’re in the price range where she could get what you want. And then I walked into this house and I went, Oh, my gosh, I’m standing in their house, I used in the course we’re going back to, you know, kind of pre cell phones. So I use the house phone there. And I called them and I called the wife and I said, whatever you’re doing stop, come over here now. I said, I’m standing in your house. Well, sure enough, I was standing in their house and the people who live there were the third owner of this house. And it was very important to the sellers, to the husband, especially who didn’t want to move that the new buyer be somebody that would live in the house for 30 years is every owner prior to them had done and the grind down. I thought it was about money because we were legitimately $150,000 apart at the time. And I said, broker brandom This has nothing to do with money. I said your client has more money than they could spend it a lifetime or two or three for that matter. I said this is about the people buying the house. I said tell them my client is wine importer. They have young children, they’re gonna live here for 30 years. And she said, Oh, no, no, no. I said, Oh, yes, yes, yes, talk to the wife, because she wants to sell. So anyway, short, long story short, this was a fabulous transaction or inspector found that the tree trunk on the back of the house was almost gone through and was going to lose the back of the house. They were very appreciative. My clients sent a bottle of champagne from the year they bought the house. They introduced each other they had parties It was a beautiful transaction when all was said and done. So when you’re in real estate, sometimes it’s not about the dollars but about what is really going on in the transaction. And I guess the baby broker talk the GrandAm something that

D.J. Paris 19:40
well, you know, majority of the people that will be listening to this podcast are most likely brokers, however, not necessarily only brokers so if there were if there are buyers, sellers investors who did want to get in touch with you to help them with a transaction or to discuss their properties, how would they get in touch with you? Well, there’s

Joan Edelberg 19:59
no place like Joan, and you can reach me on my cell phone at 84745202258474520225

D.J. Paris 20:11
Thank you so much for your time. And again, it’s I always your passion is what comes through so much in the way that you present. I think that probably goes a long way with your clients. Obviously, you get excited about it too. So it’s pretty exciting. So thank you. I know you’re busy. And by the way, I want to say that she’s up Joan. Joan has already killed me because she is all dressed up. She’s always all dressed up. But she’s particularly dressed up she thought this would be a video so we’re gonna paint the nicest most flattering picture of you.

Joan Edelberg 20:40
On camera ready today, not just regular makeup. So thank you so much for your time. My pleasure. Okay, thanks.

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